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Re: Would you buy a plug in electric car?

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 12:32 pm
by Thegreyman
what-time-is-it wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 11:54 am
Couple of niggles with the i3 when we had one this time last year for a couple of days - fixed rear windows on the back door, and you could really feel the weight of the car on undulating roads - possibly due to 18" wheels that were fitted. Yes it's a nice car, but a couple of weeks later they introduced another upgraded battery and ditched the REX.

Watching the EV market with interest, but having had an EV a couple of years ago we would only go back to an EV vehicle again when a realistic range is 250 miles + in all conditions, the charging network is more reliable and the vehicle prices are more realistic.
That is my problem with the VW ID.3, is it really that much of a step change. There are 3 version doing, off the top of my head from reading last night, roughly 200, 260 and 320 miles on the official test, so make that a real world 150, 200, 250 say. The cheapest version is £25k after government grant (how many people can spend that on a car) and the higher range ones yet more expensive. The charging structure won't cope with all the new EV's. I still think a petrol/hybrid like the i3 is a better option for the next decade rather than throwing everything into electric cars, the daft politicians have forced the hand of the car companies to do this to some extent and VW felt it had to earn redemption after the diesel emissions fiasco.

Re: Would you buy a plug in electric car?

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:04 pm
by MiniMpi
My nephew is buying a brand new Toyota Corolla Hybrid in the next couple of weeks.
It will be interesting to see what it's like as I have only driven the MINI Countryman PHEV very briefly recently.

Re: Would you buy a plug in electric car?

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:39 pm
by Bahnstormer_vRS
@davecUK - would you say that an early i3 with RX is a bit like, to drive, having a regular hybrid car?

Mind you, I'm not so keen on the gawky, tall body and skinny tyres.

Guy

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Re: Would you buy a plug in electric car?

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:51 pm
by what-time-is-it
Bahnstormer_vRS wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:39 pm
@davecUK - would you say that an early i3 with RX is a bit like, to drive, having a regular hybrid car?

Mind you, I'm not so keen on the gawky, tall body and skinny tyres.

Guy

Sent from my Xperia XZ Premium using Tapatalk
Dave has more experience than me, but the REX is simply a generator and the drivetrain is purely electric. When driving normally it can be silent, then fire up and either boost or maintain the battery charge - performance or how the car is driven doesn't change. Only difference really is a pure EV I3 may do 120 miles, but one fitted with the REX (range extender) may do 200 miles by firing up a BMW motorcycle engine that's keeping the batteries going for a little bit longer. Both can also be charged at a charge point.

Re: Would you buy a plug in electric car?

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:41 pm
by TigerChris
It’s ok banging on about charging infrastructure on journeys, but I want to know what they are going to do for people who have no driveways and park on the road? Is there gonna be a charging point every 5 yards on each pavement? Sorry, full plug in electric will never work. Not in my lifetime anyway, thankfully.

Re: Would you buy a plug in electric car?

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:49 pm
by Bahnstormer_vRS
what-time-is-it wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:51 pm
Bahnstormer_vRS wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:39 pm
@davecUK - would you say that an early i3 with RX is a bit like, to drive, having a regular hybrid car?

Mind you, I'm not so keen on the gawky, tall body and skinny tyres.

Guy

Sent from my Xperia XZ Premium using Tapatalk
Dave has more experience than me, but the REX is simply a generator and the drivetrain is purely electric. When driving normally it can be silent, then fire up and either boost or maintain the battery charge - performance or how the car is driven doesn't change. Only difference really is a pure EV I3 may do 120 miles, but one fitted with the REX (range extender) may do 200 miles by firing up a BMW motorcycle engine that's keeping the batteries going for a little bit longer. Both can also be charged at a charge point.
Cheers Chris. Understand that fully now. :thumbup:

Guy

Re: Would you buy a plug in electric car?

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 5:48 pm
by DavecUK
Bahnstormer_vRS wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:39 pm
@davecUK - would you say that an early i3 with RX is a bit like, to drive, having a regular hybrid car?

Mind you, I'm not so keen on the gawky, tall body and skinny tyres.

Guy

Sent from my Xperia XZ Premium using Tapatalk
It's like a regular electric car. When the range extender (REX) cuts in at 30mph+ it's difficult to even be aware of it unless you look at the dash. The REX can generate sufficient power to propel the car via the electric motor and maintain the battery charge, if your light on the foot it can do this almost to 70mph. This is no mean feat. If you put the range extender on early (pre plan) then there is enough lower speed periods that even if you do max motorway speeds, the REX can maintain the charge. With the REX the range is effectively unlimited. It has one other very important effect. In a pure EV you would never run it down to even 10 or 15% battery intentionally and normally try to charge it at around 20% (cos of infrastructure). Charging is only quick to 85% after that it slows to a snails pace. This means on longer journeys those 30 or 40 minute charges are only effectively topping up around 60% of capacity. That range of 240 miles on 60kW batteries ends up as a real world 144 miles at best for each 50 minute stop. It can make for a long drive. A REX you can use all your battery, no worries and then when you fast charge you get around 80% each time.

The skinny tyres have exactly the same grip as a standard tyre, simply because of the diameter, it's easy to get into, comfortable to drive, well-designed. One of the better electric cars. Unfortunately BMW are too clever by half, so when systems fail and there's lots of them, it is usually expensive to put right. I also hate BMW with a passion, so it's rather annoying they have made such a good car. It is however a very expensive car to own and run.

There's a lot of misinformation and misunderstanding about EVs and unfortunately fanboys of all makes and models rarely give you the real picture.

Re: Would you buy a plug in electric car?

Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:18 pm
by smegwina
Some interesting comments above, and having tested the Jaguar i pace, the Tesla model X and a couple of other full electric and hybrid models, I have come to the conclusion that if you exist with a narrow set of parameters, they can be useful and extremely competitive.

However, for many (including myself) they require far too much planning, forethought and compromise to be a viable alternative to the current diesel/petrol offerings.

For a large vehicle capable of reasonable mileage with no need to plan in advance there is simply no comparison between electric and fossil.

One thing I will say is that the Tesla model X is one of the most accomplished and staggeringly competent vehicles I have ever driven. The performance is simply breathtaking, the quality is astonishing and the technology is mind blowing.

The sheer size of the damn thing, the initial and ongoing costs and the limited lifespan of the vehicle however really do prevent it from being a serious alternative to the luxury saloon/SUV in general.

I genuinely think that in a few years, the electric vehicles will hold a more position as the technology and infrastructure matures.

For full disclosure I will say that I have only test driven the larger vehicles and not tested any of the smaller vehicles such as the i3 as they would never be in consideration based on my needs/requirements.

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Re: Would you buy a plug in electric car?

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 1:10 am
by DavecUK
I should add our other car is a diesel.... :)

Re: Would you buy a plug in electric car?

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:43 am
by Martin
TigerChris wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:41 pm
It’s ok banging on about charging infrastructure on journeys, but I want to know what they are going to do for people who have no driveways and park on the road? Is there gonna be a charging point every 5 yards on each pavement? Sorry, full plug in electric will never work. Not in my lifetime anyway, thankfully.
It is already happening. As featured in a recent episode of Fully Charged.

Re: Would you buy a plug in electric car?

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:58 am
by watchaholic
:lol: Put solar panels on the roof and park under a streetlight! :lol:

Re: Would you buy a plug in electric car?

Posted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:27 am
by Korkki
^ YOMANK :D