Amber Hill

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Re: Amber Hill

Post by akirk » Mon May 19, 2014 11:17 pm

I think that maybe we have a different reaction to their copy - to me it seems very straight forward - they are not criticising sponsorship - but they are suggesting that there is something is wrong when sponsorship is so high a proportion of sale price / cost. To me that seems very straight forward and nothing they are doing contradicts that - yes, I understand that it is a difficult line to walk - to criticise others in your industry for excess, and then to promote your activity... for some observers any activity in that area is excess so they see it as hypocritical - but I think that we need to stop a moment and understand the nuance of what they are saying and what they are doing and only then is it really fair to judge them...

An analogy might be that we all eat, but that doesn't stop folks speaking out against obesity - we might drink wine, but that doesn't remove the ability to disaprove of drunken behaviour / alcoholism etc.

we should also remember that we are discussing proportion of cost as marketing spend - not absolute spend... therefore as the business grows the absolute spend will grow where proportion of cost might even decline - it certainly doesn't need to increase... This will mean that we see more activity which might give an impression that therefore CWL are going against their initial approach - but without knowing the figures we can't really make that assumption...

The key is that they are not pushing watch prices up to a disproportionate level - so if the C900 sold for £6,000 and others in a similar ratio of price increase - that might make sense to drive the ability to then sponsor celebs to wear watches for lots of cash - but that is not their approach... to see some endorsement / sponsorship doesn't mean that they are even vaguely approaching the excess they criticise...

so, sorry, I don't see them hiding behind anything, nor do I see it as disingeneous - they clearly state that their marketing spend is lower - they don't pretend to not have any at all...

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Re: Amber Hill

Post by Tyke » Wed May 21, 2014 11:03 am

No problem about their advertising copy or spending commitments as long as the Brad Pitt analogy also works for the following;

'and if you do see Amber Hill wearing a Christopher Ward watch at least you'll have the satisfaction of knowing she paid for it herself'!



If this isn't the case, they shouldn't be pretending that everyone has to buy their watches (irrespective of fame).

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Re: Amber Hill

Post by akirk » Wed May 21, 2014 11:10 am

Tyke wrote:No problem about their advertising copy or spending commitments as long as the Brad Pitt analogy also works for the following;

'and if you do see Amber Hill wearing a Christopher Ward watch at least you'll have the satisfaction of knowing she paid for it herself'!



If this isn't the case, they shouldn't be pretending that everyone has to buy their watches (irrespective of fame).
;) that is not what they say or claim

they simply say that they won't spend disproportionally on marketing / sponsorship...
not that they won't spend at all

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Re: Amber Hill

Post by Tyke » Wed May 21, 2014 11:32 am

akirk wrote:
Tyke wrote:No problem about their advertising copy or spending commitments as long as the Brad Pitt analogy also works for the following;

'and if you do see Amber Hill wearing a Christopher Ward watch at least you'll have the satisfaction of knowing she paid for it herself'!



If this isn't the case, they shouldn't be pretending that everyone has to buy their watches (irrespective of fame).
;) that is not what they say or claim

they simply say that they won't spend disproportionally on marketing / sponsorship...
not that they won't spend at all

Alasdair
As I stated, I have no problems with them spending money - never said they shouldn't spend at all, but by using the Brad Pitt analogy, they are clearly stating that watches aren't being given away to people for advertising purposes in which case everyone should have to buy their own

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Re: Amber Hill

Post by akirk » Wed May 21, 2014 12:20 pm

Tyke wrote:As I stated, I have no problems with them spending money - never said they shouldn't spend at all, but by using the Brad Pitt analogy, they are clearly stating that watches aren't being given away to people for advertising purposes in which case everyone should have to buy their own
Sorry Tyke, I would have to disagree ;) I think it is fine to point out the disproportionate spend on celebs where millions pass hands to have the watch endorsed - without that meaning that you can't have any relationship with a celeb / someone to sponsor... there is a big difference between giving a watch to someone (total cost a couple of hundred pounds) and the type of endorsement which has to dramatically change the business model... they are fundamentally different things...

They don't state that watches aren't being given away to people for advertising purposes - they are saying that they won't be driving their business model with a pricing structure based on the type of deal needed to secure Brad Pitt... not the same

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Re: Amber Hill

Post by welshlad » Wed May 21, 2014 2:18 pm

Tyke wrote:No problem about their advertising copy or spending commitments as long as the Brad Pitt analogy also works for the following;

'and if you do see Amber Hill wearing a Christopher Ward watch at least you'll have the satisfaction of knowing she paid for it herself'!



If this isn't the case, they shouldn't be pretending that everyone has to buy their watches (irrespective of fame).
I agree. Given that the Brad Pitt quote is so transparent, if they have now given Amber Hill some free watches (which is fine) then they should quietly remove the Brad Pitt statement from the website and other official material, as a matter of integrity.
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Re: Amber Hill

Post by 7ee » Wed May 21, 2014 9:13 pm

welshlad wrote:f they have now given Amber Hill some free watches (which is fine) then they should quietly remove the Brad Pitt statement from the website and other official material, as a matter of integrity.
Hey, maybe these watches will appear in the NN sale once she's done with them, everyone's a winner :lol:

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Re: Amber Hill

Post by Kip » Wed May 21, 2014 9:56 pm

I think the key here might be "high profile".
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Re: Amber Hill

Post by Kip » Thu May 22, 2014 11:36 am

I pointed questions raised here to CWL. A response....

It’s pretty straight forward really. The CW Challengers programme seeks to find young people of world-class potential who have difficulty finding sponsorship, have no “silver-spoon” background and yet are determined to take on the world in their chosen field. They reflect us in that we as a “challenger” brand are taking on the might of the Swiss watch industry without the finance of a huge group. I don’t think anyone could possibly classify any of our challengers as “celebrities”.

The cost to us is very small but the impact on the careers of the Challengers could be immense at this early stage. No doubt, if they become “famous” we will not be able to support them.

In Sam Brearey we already have one World Champion; the Cambridge students we supported ended up naming a mountain after us in Tajikistan, a feat which received coverage around the world, and we could have three gold medallists at Rio….all for less than the cost of George Clooney’s annual Nespreso bill!


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Re: Amber Hill

Post by Bahnstormer_vRS » Thu May 22, 2014 1:40 pm

Great response from CWL; thanks for posting it up Kip.

I'm totally happy with CWL's ethos at present, let's see more.

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Re: Amber Hill

Post by akirk » Thu May 22, 2014 4:40 pm

Well put

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Re: Amber Hill

Post by Tyke » Thu May 22, 2014 6:36 pm

Kip wrote:I pointed questions raised here to CWL. A response....

It’s pretty straight forward really. The CW Challengers programme seeks to find young people of world-class potential who have difficulty finding sponsorship, have no “silver-spoon” background and yet are determined to take on the world in their chosen field. They reflect us in that we as a “challenger” brand are taking on the might of the Swiss watch industry without the finance of a huge group. I don’t think anyone could possibly classify any of our challengers as “celebrities”.

The cost to us is very small but the impact on the careers of the Challengers could be immense at this early stage. No doubt, if they become “famous” we will not be able to support them.

In Sam Brearey we already have one World Champion; the Cambridge students we supported ended up naming a mountain after us in Tajikistan, a feat which received coverage around the world, and we could have three gold medallists at Rio….all for less than the cost of George Clooney’s annual Nespreso bill!


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Up to the crass George Clooney quote, this was a much better representation of the kind of PR that CWL should be putting out. Keep it more like this and refrain from the inane celebrity quotes or tacky digs at other brands and it will reflect well on your growing (and mostly deserved) reputation as a quality brand.

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Re: Amber Hill

Post by Bahnstormer_vRS » Thu May 22, 2014 7:04 pm

I guess the George Clooney comment was 'private' for us forum members.

I personally chuckled at it.

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Re: Amber Hill

Post by Lavaine » Thu May 22, 2014 8:32 pm

The George Clooney cemment wasn't 'private'. They take a shot at Clooney on the website as well.
Sorry Alisdair, but I'm still with Tyke on this. Lose the celebrity bashing, and present the CW Challenger program on the website as it was presented here to us (minus Clooney), and life is good. I have no issue with the Challenger program, and think it's good marketing spend, but the webpage needs to be improved to speak to the current CW Challenger program, rather than bash the big boys and George Clooney, which does nothing to promote the brand or the Challenger program, and just sounds like sour grapes.
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Re: Amber Hill

Post by rcherryuk » Thu May 22, 2014 8:38 pm

PS, as a brand ambassador, I don't imagine that George Clooney has a very big Nespresso bill :D
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