CWL August Launch Info

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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by flashman » Sat Aug 16, 2008 9:39 pm

Thanks for that Russ. Interesting stuff as usual. I agree about the C2; I think it will be an LE and as you say, can't understand why it's not an auto now. Yes, also have similar view of C7, in spite of quartz, I might be tempted, too...it does look pretty special.

Paw, yes I'm of the same mind also. There's something special about a mechanical. :)

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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by joerattz » Sun Aug 17, 2008 2:38 am

flashman wrote:The thing that's haunting me (and I suspect others) is that Chris put the C6 out and then made the forum special auto version. If I bought say the C2 and then he did that I'd be gutted... :(
Just to be fair, I think your statement might tend to mislead others. It wasn't that Chris released the C6 (in quartz) and then decided to make an auto LE. The fact is that he produced the C6 (in quartz) and the Forum requested that he make a special LE for us, and he agreed. The forum LE turned out to be the C6 with an auto because that is the way the forum vote turned out. There were some (myself included) that would have preferred (and voted for) an LE C5 auto with a wooden dial. So I just want it to be clear that it wasn't like Chris was trying to be deceitful to his customers, he was just nice enough and open enough to our collective enthusiasm to try to make a special watch for us that by vote turned out to be an auto C6.
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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by Russ-Shettle » Sun Aug 17, 2008 4:19 am

Flash and Paw,

Just some of my personal thoughs regarding movements,

The mechanical movement is purely that, mechanical. It runs because of Man’s ingenuity to craft and engineer a movement with nothing more than the use of raw materials. Its origin dates back to the 14 century. Aside from the improvements to increase its accuracy, it has seen no other form of technology for over 500 years. That’s quite a history and yet with all the recent modern electronic advancements in timekeeping the mechanical watch still remains the most adorn and the most appreciated. Even today, improvements by purely mechanical means, still goes on. I’m talking about the recent development of Omega’s Coaxial Escapement that was employed with the ETA 2892-A2. The heart of every mechanical movement resides in this area, the balance and escapement. This is where the division of time takes place while controlling the release of energy stored by the mainspring. The escape and balance system to control time is nothing less than ingenious. One only has to look closely in order to realize the intricacy that is taking place.

What’s inspiring to me as well is that fact that the mechanical watch requires you to interact with it. You bring it to life, it gives you back time. Without you, it wouldn’t run. It’s a bonded relationship. You have to either wind it or wear it. You become personally and consciously a part of its function by the energy you give to it. There’s no way around it. For that reason alone is what makes it all the more special.

Give Quartz it's due respects:

The Quartz Movement: I’m not without any appreciation for this movement. After 400 years, it was and still remains the greatest overall technological advancement ever. What it gave to time keeping was, of course, extreme accuracy compared to the purely mechanical watch along with unprecedented affordability. It also gave and inexpensive means to add unlimited complications without a much higher price. How could anyone not appreciate that? The other types of watches, Kinetic and Eco drives are still fundamentally Quartz movements. The exception with the use of Quartz technology is the Seiko Spring Drive which is a reversal back to the traditional mechanical movement. This is another discussion altogether.

Quartz movements are very much mechanical. The main difference lays in the area where time is divided down and how the movement is advanced. In a mechanical movement, time is advanced by the controlled release of energy through the escapement and oscillations of the balance wheel. In a quartz movement, time is advanced by the movement literally being pushed along by an electromechanical solenoid controlled by a quartz timing circuit. Under those conditions, less tolerance is required than in a mechanical movement. There is no tension throughout the gear train. They are far easier and cheaper to mass produce. Less moving parts, less jeweled bearings. A mechanical movement is under constant tension. Tolerances are much higher in the gear train and more jewels are employed. Mechanicals have a much greater number of precision parts. They are more complicated and are more expensive to manufacturer. A quartz movement is a hybrid incorporating electronics, electromechanical as was as mechanical in its overall makeup.

I can certainly appreciate what the quartz movement has given to everyone. How could I not. Just look at the choices of watches there are because of it. CW’s are fine watches. The Swiss Quartz movement is probably the best there is in workmanship, value and reliability. Choosing one over the other should not be a hard decision. I make it very clear that I much prefer to own mechanicals for my deep appreciation of them but I would not hesitate to buy a watch with a Quartz movement if I really loved it. The C7, I have to say, is the one watch that might tip that scale. Cheers!

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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by Russ-Shettle » Sun Aug 17, 2008 4:27 am

joerattz wrote:Just to be fair, I think your statement might tend to mislead others. It wasn't that Chris released the C6 (in quartz) and then decided to make an auto LE. The fact is that he produced the C6 (in quartz) and the Forum requested that he make a special LE for us, and he agreed. The forum LE turned out to be the C6 with an auto because that is the way the forum vote turned out. There were some (myself included) that would have preferred (and voted for) an LE C5 auto with a wooden dial. So I just want it to be clear that it wasn't like Chris was trying to be deceitful to his customers, he was just nice enough and open enough to our collective enthusiasm to try to make a special watch for us that by vote turned out to be an auto C6.
Joe,

You’ve been around for quit some time on here and you know the history. I made implications myself without realizing I was making implications and if they were perceived as you may have felt, I certainly apologize. It's good that you come in here and give us the straight poop!

Russ

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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by Kip » Sun Aug 17, 2008 11:04 am

RSHETTLE wrote:Flash and Paw,

Just some of my personal thoughs regarding movements,

The mechanical movement is purely that, mechanical. It runs because of Man’s ingenuity to craft and engineer a movement with nothing more than the use of raw materials. Its origin dates back to the 14 century. Aside from the improvements ...............

Excellent discertation Russ. I really enjoyed reading this post. Would make an interesting paper for college I think. I would give you an "A". A valiant effort that will not stem the argument of auto /quartz, although it certainly lends an excellent personal view as to the differences among power sources. You have a fine understanding on this subject and have a passion for your favorites. Good for you. You may skip your Monday treatments! Good job.
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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by flashman » Sun Aug 17, 2008 5:18 pm

joerattz wrote:
flashman wrote:The thing that's haunting me (and I suspect others) is that Chris put the C6 out and then made the forum special auto version. If I bought say the C2 and then he did that I'd be gutted... :(
Just to be fair, I think your statement might tend to mislead others. It wasn't that Chris released the C6 (in quartz) and then decided to make an auto LE. The fact is that he produced the C6 (in quartz) and the Forum requested that he make a special LE for us, and he agreed. The forum LE turned out to be the C6 with an auto because that is the way the forum vote turned out. There were some (myself included) that would have preferred (and voted for) an LE C5 auto with a wooden dial. So I just want it to be clear that it wasn't like Chris was trying to be deceitful to his customers, he was just nice enough and open enough to our collective enthusiasm to try to make a special watch for us that by vote turned out to be an auto C6.
Hi Joe,
Thanks for the clarification, it is a fair one...but, no, I didn't mean to infer that it would be deliberate; just an honest concern that I'd buy a quartz and then find it issued as an auto later on. I know that the C6 LE was the result of a vote etc. My point is that an LE could be issued especially for a watch like the C2, that looks as if it should already be an auto, if you know what I mean. I think it's less likely for the C7, but it could happen. Whether the result of requests and a vote from the forum or any other reason, I don't want to find myself with a quartz and then see an auto come out...

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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by Terminator 2 » Sun Aug 17, 2008 11:28 pm

flashman wrote:Thanks for the clarification, it is a fair one...but, no, I didn't mean to infer that it would be deliberate; just an honest concern that I'd buy a quartz and then find it issued as an auto later on.
Joe's explanation regarding the LE was spot on flashman but I do also hear what your saying and it does concern me too. You see I guess a man can only justify so many watches from one maker. Too many would just start to get silly and its starting to make me think much deeper about which route to take in the future. I really like CWL watches and I already have 2 C3's, 2 C4's and 2 C6's so that is 3 sets of pairs already. I wasnt too fussed before because it meant I could keep one of each model boxed away in minted condition and use and abuse the others. In future though I would like to keep that to at most one of each model because if I am honest with myself I can only wear so many. As a result I find I am now tending to go down the auto route rather than quartz as I feel auto's are a better long term investment for collecting as far as maintenance is concerned. Alas the C8 is not really my type of watch but I really love the look of the C2 and the C7. I could of course buy them in quartz but I would rather have seen them launched as auto's. I too would feel a bit gutted to have bought one to eventually see it come out as an auto as I would either feel compelled to also buy an auto or simply miss out altogether as I already had one ie quartz. In time the C2 is a dead cert to be an auto. It cries out for it and I can at least see it becoming another LE if not in full production. To compound the problem of buying future CWL watches I am also starting to look at other makes which simply confuses me even further. Do I buy a C2 or C7 right away ??? I just dont know what to do now, maybe It might be worth while just sitting on the fence for a while. Im finding my self in quite a quandry. Oh decisions decisions.

:?

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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by Kip » Sun Aug 17, 2008 11:34 pm

Terminator 2 wrote:I just dont know what to do now, maybe It might be worth while just sitting on the fence for a while. Im finding my self in quite a quandry. Oh decisions decisions.

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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by joerattz » Mon Aug 18, 2008 12:20 am

flashman wrote:
joerattz wrote:
flashman wrote:The thing that's haunting me (and I suspect others) is that Chris put the C6 out and then made the forum special auto version. If I bought say the C2 and then he did that I'd be gutted... :(
Just to be fair, I think your statement might tend to mislead others. It wasn't that Chris released the C6 (in quartz) and then decided to make an auto LE. The fact is that he produced the C6 (in quartz) and the Forum requested that he make a special LE for us, and he agreed. The forum LE turned out to be the C6 with an auto because that is the way the forum vote turned out. There were some (myself included) that would have preferred (and voted for) an LE C5 auto with a wooden dial. So I just want it to be clear that it wasn't like Chris was trying to be deceitful to his customers, he was just nice enough and open enough to our collective enthusiasm to try to make a special watch for us that by vote turned out to be an auto C6.
Hi Joe,
...I didn't mean to infer that it would be deliberate; just an honest concern that I'd buy a quartz and then find it issued as an auto later on.
Right, I didn't take it that you were. I just wanted anyone reading your post to understand the order of the events that took place. But, you just never know when Chris might make an auto version of a quartz model. The C6 was designed to be able to take both a quartz and an auto and he said from the get go that an auto C6 standard edition was possible. In fact, I hope it happens. I love my yellow C6 and it has become the CW I wear most. My orange monster and yellow C6 are getting the most wrist time by far of all my watches so I would love to see an auto C6 in yellow!
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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by flashman » Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:35 pm

Too many would just start to get silly and its starting to make me think much deeper about which route to take in the future. I really like CWL watches and I already have 2 C3's, 2 C4's and 2 C6's so that is 3 sets of pairs already. I wasnt too fussed before because it meant I could keep one of each model boxed away in minted condition and use and abuse the others. In future though I would like to keep that to at most one of each model because if I am honest with myself I can only wear so many. As a result I find I am now tending to go down the auto route rather than quartz as I feel auto's are a better long term investment for collecting as far as maintenance is concerned. Alas the C8 is not really my type of watch but I really love the look of the C2 and the C7. I could of course buy them in quartz but I would rather have seen them launched as auto's. I too would feel a bit gutted to have bought one to eventually see it come out as an auto as I would either feel compelled to also buy an auto or simply miss out altogether as I already had one ie quartz. In time the C2 is a dead cert to be an auto. It cries out for it and I can at least see it becoming another LE if not in full production. To compound the problem of buying future CWL watches I am also starting to look at other makes which simply confuses me even further. Do I buy a C2 or C7 right away ??? I just dont know what to do now, maybe It might be worth while just sitting on the fence for a while. Im finding my self in quite a quandry. Oh decisions decisions.
:?[/quote]

Yeah, that sums it up for me too, Terminator. Right down to the two models I might go for, C2/C7. I want to have a varied collection so I can't just buy CWL; and when I do buy CWL it has to be absolutely the right choice. I'm really tempted by the looks of those two models but I don't think I can justify them as quartz's. After a lot of thought over the past few days, I think I'll be sitting things out for a while in the hope that some LE's emerge next year. The C2 is even less valid as a quartz purchase IMHO because I'd definitely want the strap upgrade and that just about rules it out on a cost/value basis. :( Your problem's more acute than mine T2, I've only got 2 CWL's (C3 and C5 Malvern), yet I to feel I've got to be careful with what I buy...

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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by paw3001 » Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:33 pm

Thanks Russ, I couldn't of put it better myself and in fact I didn't! :gott:

I didn't mean to come across as dismissing quartz out of hand. I started my love of watches with quartz and even LED/LCD digitals as a child and still own quite a few, including some lovely quartz CWLs.

I just now understand and appreciate the history, romance and complexity of mechanical watches. Much as I now prefer and enjoy fine wines over Blue Nun!!! :lol:
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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by flashman » Tue Aug 19, 2008 3:19 pm

I just now understand and appreciate the history, romance and complexity of mechanical watches. Much as I now prefer and enjoy fine wines over Blue Nun!!! :lol:[/quote]

I dunno PAW, some on here would love to meet a blue nun! :wink: :lol:

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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by Russ-Shettle » Tue Aug 19, 2008 3:51 pm

flashman wrote:I just now understand and appreciate the history, romance and complexity of mechanical watches. Much as I now prefer and enjoy fine wines over Blue Nun!!! :lol:
Flash

I appreciate your comments. The other day I looked the definition of Horology from several sources and they all stated the same thing one way or another: The art and science of time keeping. I wonder if the forefathers of Horology ever imagined that someday a battery powered micro-chip would take the place of their wondrous mechanical balance system so beautifully perfected over the centuries. How could they have imagined, of course.

I’ve often said that a watch was only as good as its movement. I realized later that statement could be interpreted many ways. I really meant it two ways: 1. A watch is only as interesting as its movement and 2. A watch is only as valued as its movement. But this is just MHO. To me, A well-made mechanical movement is nothing less than a tribute to man's skills, artisanship and craftsmanship at their finest level. No microchip could ever take the place of that nor be as impressive.

“To each his own”, my Mother would say. What a watch means to one person can mean something entirely different to someone else. What does a watch represent to you?

Take my daughter, for example. She buys cheap fashion watches to go with her wardrobe. She could care less about monitoring time, accuracy or movements or the craft. Like any other, it’s just a piece of jewelry to her to go with her outfit and that’s fine if that’s what makes her happy. When I showed the movement in my C5 Malvern and how beautifully finished it was she said, “Yes Dad, that’s nice but my watch comes with 5 different colored straps. I’ll bet yours doesn’t”

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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by WatchLove_OS » Tue Aug 19, 2008 3:59 pm

RSHETTLE wrote: “Yes Dad, that’s nice but my watch comes with 5 different colored straps. I’ll bet yours doesn’t”

Russ
:lachtot: :lachtot: :lachtot: Well it could if you wanted it to Russ!!

I have been keeping an eye on this thread and its GREAT! Lots of wonderful info

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Re: CWL August Launch Info

Post by Yoda » Tue Aug 19, 2008 5:18 pm

Russ, daughters around the world - just the same. I wish I could do something with mine!

Actually CW missed a trick with the new XX watch (can't remember its designation) with different coloured facets and straps. Still, mine hasn't got enough pairs of shoes at the moment!
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