SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

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JAFO
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by JAFO »

The certificate I got includes the serial number, but also a list of all the test values in the different positions. It's not just a certificate like a warranty card. Maybe the cost centre keep a full record of all the test results. If not I don't see how they can produce a new certificate.
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by jkbarnes »

JasperCat wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 6:14 pm
Ok, CW customer support have replied quickly and will get their Switzerland team to try and locate the COSC certificate... failing that they are offering a small discount on the purchased price. I'll await the outcome of their search and take it from there :thumbup:
That’s an excellent response! Well done CW. I could have seen them blowing this off, given the watch was already marked down in the sale.
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by JasperCat »

JAFO wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 6:32 pm
The certificate I got includes the serial number, but also a list of all the test values in the different positions. It's not just a certificate like a warranty card. Maybe the cost centre keep a full record of all the test results. If not I don't see how they can produce a new certificate.
COSC themselves are very clear...

They can issue one duplicate certificate on request from the manufacturer (not sure if that carries a charge for them). Test results seem to be held for 10 years.

Beyond that, a movement would have to be returned and re-tested, which would of course carry a charge for the manufacturer.

Yes, both my other COSC certificates have the full set of test results for various positions, including some at high and low temperatures.

My Cranwell actually behaves almost exactly as per its test certificate, such that the mean daily rate is spot on and if I store it in various positions it runs as per the test results too. Fascinating stuff and potential useful too 👍

However, beyond the initial testing on receiving that watch, I no just wear it and stick it on the winder overnight. It keeps excellent time at +2.5 secs p/d. I use the winder because some days I’m not active enough to keep it going (desk job), but also it serves as a storage case.

I digress... the COSC certificate itself won’t make the watch run any better but at least shows it did once run in spec and how well it runs for various positions.
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by JasperCat »

jkbarnes wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 7:50 pm
JasperCat wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 6:14 pm
Ok, CW customer support have replied quickly and will get their Switzerland team to try and locate the COSC certificate... failing that they are offering a small discount on the purchased price. I'll await the outcome of their search and take it from there :thumbup:
That’s an excellent response! Well done CW. I could have seen them blowing this off, given the watch was already marked down in the sale.
Absolutely, if I forgot mention it earlier... the response so far for CW customer support has been exactly as hoped... nice one and thanks to them so far 👍
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by JAFO »

If CW can locate or obtain a reprint of the correct certificate it's a much better outcome isn't it. My watch was my first chronometer, and I'd never seen the certificate befire. It was a very pleasant surprise. It's one thing seeing it on the dial, but it's another thing having the official grading to keep with the rest of the provenance.
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by JasperCat »

JAFO wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 9:01 pm
If CW can locate or obtain a reprint of the correct certificate it's a much better outcome isn't it. My watch was my first chronometer, and I'd never seen the certificate befire. It was a very pleasant surprise. It's one thing seeing it on the dial, but it's another thing having the official grading to keep with the rest of the provenance.
Exactly, it won't change the watch performance, but it is part of the provenance for the movement. I remember when I first got my C9 5 Day Automatic a few years ago, I was fascinated by how they test these and to know just what that movement was capable of. It may drift over time, but you know that once it passed that test.

Not sure where I saw it recently, but someone described it as like getting a degree... at one point in their life someone was deemed worthy and capable of passing those exams to gain the qualification, no matter how their capability may diminish subsequently with age :D
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by MarkingTime »

Just a thought. The watch is a chronometer and one would expect a COSC document to accompany it. One option might be to ask CW to write a letter stating that the wrong certificate was issued. It won't be the actual certificate, but it will at least prove provenance of the movement conforming to spec. It would answer any queries to a potential buyer further down the line.
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by JasperCat »

MarkingTime wrote:
Sun Jan 17, 2021 10:15 pm
Just a thought. The watch is a chronometer and one would expect a COSC document to accompany it. One option might be to ask CW to write a letter stating that the wrong certificate was issued. It won't be the actual certificate, but it will at least prove provenance of the movement conforming to spec. It would answer any queries to a potential buyer further down the line.
Good suggestion thanks.

I’m going to let them try and locate it (or duplicate) and if not, then this might be an option... although I don’t intend to sell, it makes sense to have the provenance :thumbup:
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by tikkathree »

JasperCat wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 1:36 pm
I've emailed customer support, requesting the COSC certificate or duplicate (which I believe they can obtain), so we'll what happens.

In the meantime, the watch is currently running about -5 secs p/d, over the last 48 hours. I'm aware that they can take a good while to settle in, so drawing no conclusions right now and this watch/movement has probably sat in a box for a years too. I've rewound back to full power (lovely winding action) and wearing it normally, so see how it gets on.

Incidentally, my C65 Cranwell took a good few weeks wearing it until it settled (some days minus and some days plus), but eventually settled down to +2.5 secs p/d, which is almost exactly as per it's mean daily rate from the COSC certificate (although it was only actually tested a few months earlier too) :thumbup:
And yet the observation of timekeeping to COSC standards takes place when a movement is brand new. So I go to bed wondering how to explain this phenomenon....... :problem: :problem: :problem: :problem:
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by JasperCat »

tikkathree wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 12:07 am
JasperCat wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 1:36 pm
I've emailed customer support, requesting the COSC certificate or duplicate (which I believe they can obtain), so we'll what happens.

In the meantime, the watch is currently running about -5 secs p/d, over the last 48 hours. I'm aware that they can take a good while to settle in, so drawing no conclusions right now and this watch/movement has probably sat in a box for a years too. I've rewound back to full power (lovely winding action) and wearing it normally, so see how it gets on.

Incidentally, my C65 Cranwell took a good few weeks wearing it until it settled (some days minus and some days plus), but eventually settled down to +2.5 secs p/d, which is almost exactly as per it's mean daily rate from the COSC certificate (although it was only actually tested a few months earlier too) :thumbup:
And yet the observation of timekeeping to COSC standards takes place when a movement is brand new. So I go to bed wondering how to explain this phenomenon....... :problem: :problem: :problem: :problem:
Indeed, it is strange. Although one thing I make sure now with the Cranwell, is to keep it properly wound by putting it on the winder overnight. With my slightly more sedentary work style now (working from home), I found that the auto mechanism wasn’t being wound enough (it stopped a few times randomly after a few weeks).

As I understand it, during COSC testing they keep the movements fully wound every 24 hours too,so might explain the consistency :thumbup:
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by JasperCat »

I'm very happy to report that CW customer support have contacted me today to confirm that a new (duplicate?) COSC certificate is on its way from Switzerland and will be sent to me on arrival. I will of course be sending the original (incorrect) one back to CW :thumbup:

Given this and the very successful recent replacement for the Cranwell bracelet broken QR spring bar, I'm pleased to report that CW customer support have been very helpful indeed... thank you especially to Katie at CW :clap:
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by H0rati0 »

Now, that's a good result and well worth remembering that duplicates can be obtained.

Bravo 8)
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by Toph »

That’s great news! I even checked my C8 Pr to see if I had yours , but my cert and movement number matched
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by JasperCat »

Thanks all and thanks for checking your own certs for mismatches :thumbup:

Seems like a good result all round, I’m happy and hopefully the (incorrect) cert I received can be re-united with its movement/owner too :D
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Re: SH21 Serial Number and COSC mismatch

Post by MiniMpi »

Outstanding result :clap:
Must say I'm not sure if I've checked my COSC serial numbers matched the various watches.....something to do on a quiet day perhaps in the future.
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