Watch World volume 6 issue 4

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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by f1colin »

Seiko have managed it. But I hope if CW have plans for this they pull something special out the bag.[/quote]


Likewise. I'm not sure Seiko have managed it - I don't know anyone who has spent more than £450 on a Seiko and that was an F1 Sportura Honda edition. Yes, they have some high end stuff but who buys it? Would be intriguing to know the volumes by model across several manufacturers.. inc CW. Does anyone know of a member with a C9 JH, bar Kip?
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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by Kip »

highway62 wrote:So who, amongst forum members would be prepared to send 2k on a CWL?
I'm in........would you expect otherwise? :lol:
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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by Amor Vincit Omnia »

highway62 wrote:So who, amongst forum members would be prepared to send 2k on a CWL?
It would have to be the right watch, but I think that would be true for most of us spending that amount on any watch!
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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by downer »

For me at least, when spending £2k on a watch, I would need to feel somewhat confident that I could recoup a significant proportion if I resold it.

CW's have excellent value retention at the sub-£400 level, but beyond that, it is unproven. Therefore, I would certainly hesitate to put £2k into an unknown quantity.

Regarding Seiko, they have indeed stretched into high territory with the GS and spring drive ranges, but I would argue that they are totally different beasts to the run-of-the-mill lower ranges.

Can CW provide sufficient differentiation? It would need significant investment IMHO...
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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by robinbarke »

downer wrote:For me at least, when spending £2k on a watch, I would need to feel somewhat confident that I could recoup a significant proportion if I resold it.

CW's have excellent value retention at the sub-£400 level, but beyond that, it is unproven. Therefore, I would certainly hesitate to put £2k into an unknown quantity.

Regarding Seiko, they have indeed stretched into high territory with the GS and spring drive ranges, but I would argue that they are totally different beasts to the run-of-the-mill lower ranges.

Can CW provide sufficient differentiation? It would need significant investment IMHO...
A watch with CHR.Ward on its face at a price of £2000 would leave me speechless and probably impotent!

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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by downer »

robinbarke wrote:
A watch with CHR.Ward on its face at a price of £2000 would leave me speechless and probably impotent!

Robin
:lol: If you ever see one, DO NOT look directly at it!!
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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by androo »

for £2k it would have to be very special. Not adverse to it but there are a few watches I like in that price range and I can't save for those so likleyhood of me saving for that are near zero
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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by Kip »

Everytime that CWL has broken a new barrier, price or otherwise, so many have had doubts that the watches would sell whether it was a limited edition, limited production or part of the regular line.

Well it would seem that CWL must be doing something right as the C40, C9 Chono, C9 JH, C90 Beckett's, the COSC Quartz and the C50 have all broken new ground in different areas for CWL, including price. It would seem that however Chris is doing his research he is coming up with an overall winning formula. They may not all be superstars but all have served to enhance the line and reputation of the company

I believe that the addition of the COSC and especially the C9JH are steps toward making CWL a true manufacture to better serve the long term needs of the company. it would certainly seem a necessary goal given the state of turmoil within the movement industry. if CWL wants to remain Swiss Made he will need more and more movements as the company continues to grow. I believe he is moving in this direction deliberately and with caution.

Generally speaking, most companies that come out with high end complicated or highly decorated watches, do not expect to sell a lot of them. They are used to represent what the company is capabable of building. Many times these features and developments evenyually make their way to less expensive models.

If CWL is planning a high end watch, I would expect that the watch would be another, albeit more expensive, example of something that falls within the company ethos.
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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by Amor Vincit Omnia »

Well said, Kip! :clap:
I'd prefer to wait and see rather than hazard too many guesses. It would be an unusual person who liked or wanted EVERY watch from one maker (sorry, Kip! :lol: )
The man has done a pretty good job so far, so I'm willing to see what he comes up with in 2012. If I don't like it, fair enough, and if I do, well we shall see...
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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by robinbarke »

Kip wrote:Everytime that CWL has broken a new barrier, price or otherwise, so many have had doubts that the watches would sell whether it was a limited edition, limited production or part of the regular line.

Well it would seem that CWL must be doing something right as the C40, C9 Chono, C9 JH, C90 Beckett's, the COSC Quartz and the C50 have all broken new ground in different areas for CWL, including price. It would seem that however Chris is doing his research he is coming up with an overall winning formula. They may not all be superstars but all have served to enhance the line and reputation of the company

I believe that the addition of the COSC and especially the C9JH are steps toward making CWL a true manufacture to better serve the long term needs of the company. it would certainly seem a necessary goal given the state of turmoil within the movement industry. if CWL wants to remain Swiss Made he will need more and more movements as the company continues to grow. I believe he is moving in this direction deliberately and with caution.

Generally speaking, most companies that come out with high end complicated or highly decorated watches, do not expect to sell a lot of them. They are used to represent what the company is capabable of building. Many times these features and developments evenyually make their way to less expensive models.

If CWL is planning a high end watch, I would expect that the watch would be another, albeit more expensive, example of something that falls within the company ethos.
I could go along with that Kip if the company was not sending out so many conflicting signals that were not brand enhancing. For example, the almost continous sales, dire logo rebranding and seeking high volumes of women's cheap quartz fashion items. To maintain the interest of enthusiasts and collectors there has to be the perception of brand value and potential enhancement and I wonder about that with the current direction of travel.

Robin
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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by highway62 »

that damn knotweed!!! :lol:
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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by poppydoodlesdad »

.
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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by Kip »

robinbarke wrote:
Kip wrote:Everytime that CWL has broken a new barrier, price or otherwise, so many have had doubts that the watches would sell whether it was a limited edition, limited production or part of the regular line.

Well it would seem that CWL must be doing something right as the C40, C9 Chono, C9 JH, C90 Beckett's, the COSC Quartz and the C50 have all broken new ground in different areas for CWL, including price. It would seem that however Chris is doing his research he is coming up with an overall winning formula. They may not all be superstars but all have served to enhance the line and reputation of the company

I believe that the addition of the COSC and especially the C9JH are steps toward making CWL a true manufacture to better serve the long term needs of the company. it would certainly seem a necessary goal given the state of turmoil within the movement industry. if CWL wants to remain Swiss Made he will need more and more movements as the company continues to grow. I believe he is moving in this direction deliberately and with caution.

Generally speaking, most companies that come out with high end complicated or highly decorated watches, do not expect to sell a lot of them. They are used to represent what the company is capabable of building. Many times these features and developments evenyually make their way to less expensive models.

If CWL is planning a high end watch, I would expect that the watch would be another, albeit more expensive, example of something that falls within the company ethos.
I could go along with that Kip if the company was not sending out so many conflicting signals that were not brand enhancing. For example, the almost continous sales, dire logo rebranding and seeking high volumes of women's cheap quartz fashion items. To maintain the interest of enthusiasts and collectors there has to be the perception of brand value and potential enhancement and I wonder about that with the current direction of travel.

Robin
We may have to agree to disagree on some of this Robin. I do understand what you are saying and most certainly respect your opinion.

Continuous sales - I believe that this is something that CWL is looking at. They only have the website to post them and emails to get you there but they are aware of some negativity in this area.

Rebranding - despite the volume of negative talk on this forum, overall there appears to be a positive reaction based on reactions from customers. Forum members seem to cover the range of despising it, to loving it, with most somewhere in the middle or adopting a wait and see position. Using "Dire rebranding" may be a bit strong now that the initial shock has worn off.

Women's cheap quartz fashion items - I have seen and heard this said a few times, but the fact remains that despite how a few may percieve the new Ladies Collection, overall they are doing quite well. Yes there are some slow models but the majority are selling. This I would expect with any across the board introduction of a new line. Some winners..some losers.

They are all quartz because while introducing a new line into a category that is driven by fashion and style, CWL chose to go after the majority to give a greater chance of success to the whole line. We have a demand on the forum for some autos and they may come yet now that the collection is proving itself and generating a return on the investment.

I will also point out that CW has heard comments from customers and the forum alike and yesterday lowered prices across the board on the "Ladies Collection". Oddly, with all the hawks in this place..no one commented on that.

Perception of collectors and enthusiasts - Not the core market but most certainly one that CW respects and pays attention to. Without them we may not have many of the models that have come to market. It will remain to be seen with the expansion of the price range how this works out but, as I said before, If the developements and changes inspired by having upmarket models are fueled by the profits of the core range, then we shall have the best of both worlds with the value in all price ranges. CWL has no intentions that I know of to abandon the customer base. I am sure this would be a fatal error at this point.
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Re: Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by robinbarke »

Thanks Kip for your well reasoned response but one which really doesn't address the branding issue. Many of those slowly building up a collection of CW watches are, I suggest, doing so because they believe that, in the light of the company's originally stated objectives, the brand would gradually be recognised as value enhancing, covetable and highly respected by knowledgeable collectors. I am not sure that this will be achieved, neither am I sure that the company's present trajectory is designed to achieve this. I cannot identify any competitor currently offering £100 quartz and a £2000 mechanical watch that has any pretentions of brand added value with the possible exception of Seiko.

Perhaps we might persuade the company to let us have a policy statement so that we may have confidence in building up our collections or maybe looking elsewhere.

In the meantime, how about relocating to glorious Royal Berkshire, becoming CW's spin doctor-in-chief and living happily ever after? Please don't trouble to respond further.

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Watch World volume 6 issue 4

Post by SlvrSrfr »

If it's something like the Zenith El Primero movement or, better yet, a perpetual calendar, I'll be willing to fork out the £2000 in a heartbeat. With a 7750, I'll have to see how CW differentiates from the others in the same price range. Bottom line, I'll wait and see what is being offered before basing my judgment.