Thank you!missF wrote: ↑Sat Apr 22, 2023 1:03 pmWell I disagree with this - you’ve just made a long a considered post about homages in general and CW in particular with a viewpoint that’s wide ranging across the industry along with pages of other posts - some on the same topics and some about a watch that hasn’t even been released yet.Ash_Ketchum_007 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 22, 2023 10:30 am But it seems that criticism isn't allowed and the gatekeeping is just too strong.
There’s nobody gatekeeping here and plenty of criticism. Other Brands are equally discussed. And usually in a good open - minded way. It’s a forum of watchies- not a fan club.
Anyway - welcome! I enjoyed reading your first (?) post. Hope you’ll be around for more
My comment was based on what I saw on this post and and the criticisms seem to be met with claims of hate and snobbery.
I'll add a few more points to my above comment.
I forgot to mention the Zenith Defy. The first iteration without the 12 sided bezel wasn't really criticised for being an Homage. The bracelet was different and the indices were different. However, the current 12 sided version has been heavily criticised for being a homage. Even the side profile of the case is very similar. There are people who like the Defy. Is it wrong? No. People just feel that Zenith can do better. The Chronomaster original is loved by everyone but the Chronomaster sport with the Daytona bezel is criticised for copying Rolex. They didn't get a free pass because of the name on the dial.
The latest Straum wasn't accused of being a Royal Oak homage. It is a brand that is even smaller than CW but no one called it a homage. Look at Atelier Wen. People praised their dial but called out the 1:1 VC 222 bracelet. They could have easily come up with something new but they spoiled it by copying something else. Let's assume a situation where Rolex releases an integrated bracelet watch with 8/12 sided bezel, similar bracelet to AP and mercedes hands. Sure, it'll have a "Rolex twist" to it but will Rolex get away with it? They'll be the butt of all jokes. Now, the same wouldn't be the case if they recreated the oysterquartz. Why? It just looks like an integrated bracelet version of their regular models.
Check out the comment below yours where criticism is being branded as lazy hatred. This is what is weird. CW is a watch brand. It isn't some sort of sports team. I find this weird about watch brand fans in general. What is the point of hating CW? CW doesn't have any sort of history and they aren't big enough to gather hatred. People expressing their desire to see a CW with their own identity aren't expressing hatred. They want that to happen because they like certain aspects of CW. The Bel Canto is the only time where they came close to these "industry busting" claims and people want them to ride the wave and create their own identity. The other models aren't industry busting in any way, shape or form and I find this artificial "Us vs the world" type rebuttals to be cringey when it comes to watch criticism. CW listens to its fans but this sort of defence isn't going to bring about changes. A lot of watch enthusiasts consider CW to be a mainstream brand instead of a "microbrand". CW is no longer competing with the likes of Traska. With this boosted status, people are bound to expect a stronger identity. It makes sense.
The Trident Pro, for example, has its own charm. The bezel doesn't resemble any currently available popular model from any any popular brand. The hands are different and the trident counter weight on the seconds hand is a nice touch. The baton indices is fine here but again, it would be nice if CW completely moved away from this. Just for the sake of variety. The bracelet is the remaining part. A change would make it completely unique. As I said earlier, there are hundreds of ways to create a 3 link bracelet. They could even create a "lightcatcher" bracelet with chamfered outside edges and chamfered wide mid links with a slight reduction in height of each individual link. I'm just blurting out stuff on the spot without even putting thought into it. CW can absolutely create stuff without taking "inspiration". I don't see a lot of homage talk about the Trident Pro's dial or bezel but the Aquitaine received some flak. Why? It's basically Fifty Fathom's bezel, style + Sub indices bracelet, + CW hands. Again, it's fine and there are worse offenders but CW can do better and at the same time, it bloats the catalogue and dilutes CW's "identity". Even Seiko's divers move away from the design of the base Seiko 5 diver as the prices rise up. CW isn't Tissot or Longines. These are mass market brands under one huge corporation and they have retail chains around the world. A huge, identity less catalogue makes sense when it comes to them but it seems a bit counter intuitive to an online only enthusiast brand that is trying to move into Tag, Oris territory.
With respect to the Twelve - I hope the full reveal changes my mind. I wasn't really expecting the birth of the next icon from this but I certainly expected something refreshing but I was slightly disappointed to see certain things. I'm sure that it'll sell like hot cakes. There isn't a lot of options in this range with respect to integrated bracelet watches. The PRX is the obvious starter watch and then you'd zoom your way to the Zenith Defy. ML Aikon is the most popular model in between this and I'm sure that the CW will beat it in price/quality and the ML Aikon is considered to be a homage as well. There are a lot of microbrand options but CW will grab more attention. They'll rake in the moolah for sure but I just wanted to see something a bit different. I basically wanted it to be the Sinn 556 of integrated bracelet watches. We'll see.