The faux luxury quote

Discuss Christopher Ward watches
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Marvin
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by Marvin »

robert75 wrote:
In what way? You can still discuss CW watches and even tear the company to pieces if you want more than a few have done so. Try that or even voicing half the criticism CW has come in for over the past couple of days on a few other forums and you would be banned, tarred and feathered as an example to others.
I don't think that's the issue here, surely?

Read between the lines. People are really frustrated and annoyed.

Comments express those feelings, and that's the main point.
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by hughesyn »

One of the CW facebook comments Yesterday at 10:09am says:
"There is more to come in due course with regard to justification of the design changes, hopefully these will answer some of your queries."

So hopefully some more info will come out soon.
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by bitfield »

Kip wrote: Certainly this change is not without flaws. Certainly it could have been done better. How this all translates to the doom and gloom I have been reading for the past several days boggles my mind. How did we all become so negative rather than constructive?
Things like design are necessarily subjective, and aren't best done by focus group. Even so, it would be foolish to dismiss all criticism of the design as 'negativity'. You can't argue people into liking something. When your most passionate customers all hate what you've done, that's valuable information. It may not be what you want to hear, of course, but this is a business, not a vanity project.
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by BobMunro »

I only discovered the CW brand a couple of years ago and therefore haven't been on the same journey as a lot of forum members.

So in that context I see this as a company from whom I have purchased from in the past deciding, rightly or wrongly, to take a new direction. I own 7 CW watches, all purchased because I liked them for various reasons - and I still like them (I don't sell watches). If I like the new direction and the new products that may bring then I will continue to purchase models I like the look of - if I don't then I won't. I won't be losing any sleep over it either way. There are many other brands that I have purchased in the past and will continue to do so, if what I see is what I want. To paraphrase from the greatest film ever made 'It's business, it isn't personal'.

But as I said, for many it is personal because of the CW journey they have shared. I can understand that but not share it.
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by Marvin »

bitfield wrote:
Kip wrote: Certainly this change is not without flaws. Certainly it could have been done better. How this all translates to the doom and gloom I have been reading for the past several days boggles my mind. How did we all become so negative rather than constructive?
Things like design are necessarily subjective, and aren't best done by focus group. Even so, it would be foolish to dismiss all criticism of the design as 'negativity'. You can't argue people into liking something. When your most passionate customers all hate what you've done, that's valuable information. It may not be what you want to hear, of course, but this is a business, not a vanity project.
Agreed. +1
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by Tyke »

hughesyn wrote:One of the CW facebook comments Yesterday at 10:09am says:
"There is more to come in due course with regard to justification of the design changes, hopefully these will answer some of your queries."

So hopefully some more info will come out soon.
That would be good, but in this fast moving world and having taken on such lively advisers, one might expect a more fleet of foot response - now 26 hours and counting. Perhaps they are trying to think up more clever slogans and marketing speak to confuse us yokels?
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by mibby »

I don't really care about the website, the magazine or the new marketing company. I don't care if the new target market is hipsters, youngsters or dumpsters. None of this stuff matters when I buy a watch.

I do, however, dislike the childish new logo to the point where I really wouldn't wear a watch with it on.

A 38mm white-faced Trident Classic with either of the previous logos would have been a must-buy. I even like the new hands, and love the box crystal. But that logo is a fatal turn-off. :(
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by Galton321 »

Kip makes some good points some of the reactions have bordered a bit on the hysterical but as others have said nature abhors a vacuum. The roll out of the changes have not been handled well. We don't know who is saying what. As I said in another post it looks light CWL are repudiating all they have already achieved. What facts do we have about what matters, the watches.

1. There's news of a more decorated SH21 - good news
2. New power reserve version of the SH21 - good news
3. SH21 UTC/Worldtimer complication - good news
4. New CH21 C8 - good news.
5. There is promise of new designs to come - good news. Historically people of complained about too many homages. Well you might get something different.

Most of the comments have concerned brand image. Not really something I'm concerned about. All I'm interested in is do I like the watch, spec, design, price etc. What others think of my choices doesn't bother me and I don't buy watches as an investment.

People complained endlessly about the existing logo. Unfortunately new one is not universally popular. My initial reaction was I didn't like it. But is growing on me and I think it looks good on the new C65. Gives it a clean look. But don't like it on the C65 Vintage. Again I'm not fussed about logos what matters is that it is designed to be sympathetic with the rest of the Face design. Although logo/brand recognition seems to be important to many. A Stowa without any logo must create all sorts of anxiety! Small and unobtrusive usually works best for me. Maybe we prefer faux-luxury after all. I'm now going to wait for the smoke to clear. What matters is the watches and I'll make my judgement when I see them.
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by st-rider »

Kip wrote:...The magazine, has for some time, been more of a lifestyle magazine....The magazine has several other fine stories that you may or may not like. If one is not interested in them, skip them. ....
Thank you for reminding me (us) of that.

I see on page 45 Christopher Ward have a new PR agency, PHA Media.
Shelley Frosdick wrote:...extending awareness of Christopher Ward to a place where more and more people can enjoy the experience of owning a beautiful, well designed watch.
Which is something I think and would like to believe the forum members here can relate to and get behind.
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by robert75 »

Tyke wrote:The very fact that we haven't been banned, tarred & feathered points to the irrelevance of our views in their new world.

One wonders if Chris et al will continue the forum chats in future - will Hello or the new PR people allow that (oops, creating scenarios again [-X ). Actually, speaking of the new PR people, they don't seem to be doing much to promote the positivity of the current situation, c'mon guys, get spinning, it's what they pay you for.
Harsh IMO

When CW have messed up (in the minds of forum members) they have been punched senseless on these forums in the past something I have never seen on other watch forums where one word against the party line and out you go. You could look at it this way if he didn't care what we thought he would have someone here deleting negative comments so it all looks rosy and nice and CW is the bestest, most wonderful watch company in the world its true, the internet says so.

New logo, new website, new movements, new watches. So far it looks like they have already told Hello to remove that daft quartz thing from their website give them a chance!
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by asqwerth »

I think it's pure speculation to say forum members are allowed to 'get away with it' because CWL don't care and the forum is irrelevant. I'm sure it's coloured by unhappiness over the image and logo changes.

But the same HUGE hue and cry happened here over the CHR WARD logo change. If I recall, there was also criticism directed at the then image consultants. And it was allowed to continue.

This is really CWL being damned if they do (censor the forum) and if they don't, instead of being lauded for at least keeping their promise of allowing this forum to be free in its views.
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by theaub »

'Faux luxury' - utterly meaningless. The worst kind of psychobabble.
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by fishman »

bitfield wrote:
Kip wrote: Certainly this change is not without flaws. Certainly it could have been done better. How this all translates to the doom and gloom I have been reading for the past several days boggles my mind. How did we all become so negative rather than constructive?
Things like design are necessarily subjective, and aren't best done by focus group. Even so, it would be foolish to dismiss all criticism of the design as 'negativity'. You can't argue people into liking something. When your most passionate customers all hate what you've done, that's valuable information. It may not be what you want to hear, of course, but this is a business, not a vanity project.
Agreed. It's very important to pay attention to your customer! Customer feedback, as bitfield points out, is valuable information and it doesn't cost a thing except the willingness to listen. Now any company can and must make strategic decisions from time to time that require going in a different direction. Existing customers may or may not agree, but as long as a customer feels that he or she was listened to and respected the relationship is preserved and that's the most important thing.
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by fishman »

BobMunro wrote:I only discovered the CW brand a couple of years ago and therefore haven't been on the same journey as a lot of forum members.

So in that context I see this as a company from whom I have purchased from in the past deciding, rightly or wrongly, to take a new direction. I own 7 CW watches, all purchased because I liked them for various reasons - and I still like them (I don't sell watches). If I like the new direction and the new products that may bring then I will continue to purchase models I like the look of - if I don't then I won't. I won't be losing any sleep over it either way. There are many other brands that I have purchased in the past and will continue to do so, if what I see is what I want. To paraphrase from the greatest film ever made 'It's business, it isn't personal'.

But as I said, for many it is personal because of the CW journey they have shared. I can understand that but not share it.
Well said! I'm in the same boat as I bought my first CW watch about fifteen months ago and now I have four. I like each one and am very pleased with the quality, design and price. The original CW insight was that a high quality and beautiful watch could be delivered to the customer at significantly lower prices compared to the existing watchmakers. How? By going direct to the customer via the internet,eliminating expensive advertising, and charging a markup of a maximum of three times. As long as this business model stays in place as the focus of the company then I'll continue to consider and buy CW watches that I like regardless of the logo or marketing changes. If I see new models that I don't like,prices rising etc then I'll move on to other manufacturers that make things that I do like. I've seen many a business over time get away from its core values that made it successful and suffer or go out of business as a result. CW isn't immune to this phenomena and I hope that management is smart enough to know this, but you never know. BobMunro is absolutely right to quote the Godfather because "It's business, it isn't personal".
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Re: The faux luxury quote

Post by mibby »

Proper luxury:

Image
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