rkovars wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 9:12 pm Mike France has stated in public that it was 3x manufacturing cost. My rough napkin math without knowledge of the deals that CW has with suppliers (for example I am certain CW doesn't pay RRP for movements they are too high in volume for that) over the years have been pretty close to 3x what it would cost to build. The wild cards are the Bel Cantos as those I don't personally have any reference for. I have no idea how much it would cost to manufacture the parts 'above the dial' but I bet it isn't cheap.

Timishere wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 7:46 pm I've always thought that...the 3x cost is a primarily a nice marketing story (but the watches are great value vs others so I'm not complaining)

akirk wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 5:35 pm I wouldn't expect marketing to be in cost prices
cost should be cost of watch delivered to this shore
marketing is under overheads etc.

3x is presumably something like
- cost 1/3
- overheads 1/3
- profits and poss tax etc. 1/3

We are starting to split hairs. I believe what I have read and heard from MF is:
3X cost = 1x manufacturing, 1x overhead (includes marketing), and 1x profit

So, if marketing costs goes up then the 3X goes up as well because it is part of the overall cost structure. As others have noted, CWL is still very good value for money when compared to other major brands.

nycWATCHnerd wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 9:47 pm

nbg wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 7:04 pm

nycWATCHnerd wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 1:06 pm Rolex (and most other major brands) increase prices every year.

Not the first time I have seen the incorrect statement that Rolex increase prices every year!

They certainly haven’t increased prices every year since I first became interested in the brand.
Most years isn’t every year.

They may not raise prices on every watch every year but they do raises prices on some/different watches every year.

Incorrect. Again!

Neil

nbg wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 9:53 pm

nycWATCHnerd wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 9:47 pm

nbg wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 7:04 pm
Not the first time I have seen the incorrect statement that Rolex increase prices every year!

They certainly haven’t increased prices every year since I first became interested in the brand.
Most years isn’t every year.

They may not raise prices on every watch every year but they do raises prices on some/different watches every year.

Incorrect. Again!

I am not going to get into an internet debate. Unless you are, and have been, Head of Sales for Rolex Global for a very long time you do not know 100% either. At best you are making an educating guess based on your own experience. Show me data to backup your claim.

nycWATCHnerd wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 9:56 pm

nbg wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 9:53 pm

nycWATCHnerd wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 9:47 pm

They may not raise prices on every watch every year but they do raises prices on some/different watches every year.

Incorrect. Again!

I am not going to get into an internet debate. Unless you are, and have been, Head of Sales for Rolex Global for a very long time you do not know 100% either. At best you are making an educating guess based on your own experience. Show me data to backup your claim.

Likewise!

Neil

nbg wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 10:40 pm

nycWATCHnerd wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 9:56 pm

nbg wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 9:53 pm
Incorrect. Again!

I am not going to get into an internet debate. Unless you are, and have been, Head of Sales for Rolex Global for a very long time you do not know 100% either. At best you are making an educating guess based on your own experience. Show me data to backup your claim.

Likewise!

Neil

My unscientific data is simple, I and many members of my family have been Rolex enthusiasts for a very long time and owned many of their watches purchased directly from jewelers (aka Rolex ADs). We also follow the cost of our own and new watches mostly for insurance purposes.

This started in 1967 when my mother bought my father his first Rolex: 1967 Air King. His next was a new 1983 DateJust.

I purchased my first Rolex in 1994, a new Explorer II Polar. Then (all new from authorized dealers) a 2010 DateJust, 2018 Submariner Date 40mm, 2019 Explorer II 42mm, 2023 Submariner Date, and so on.

My Uncles all have multiple Rolex watches.

A few of my brothers have multiple Rolex watches.

While I cannot prove 100% that every year since 1967 Rolex has raised prices, I believe if not all of them in many years they did and still do.

What is your hypothesis based on?

nycWATCHnerd wrote: ↑Sat Jan 11, 2025 12:54 am

nbg wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 10:40 pm

nycWATCHnerd wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 9:56 pm

I am not going to get into an internet debate. Unless you are, and have been, Head of Sales for Rolex Global for a very long time you do not know 100% either. At best you are making an educating guess based on your own experience. Show me data to backup your claim.

Likewise!

Neil

My unscientific data is simple, I and many members of my family have been Rolex enthusiasts for a very long time and owned many of their watches purchased directly from jewelers (aka Rolex ADs). We also follow the cost of our own and new watches mostly for insurance purposes.

This started in 1967 when my mother bought my father his first Rolex: 1967 Air King. His next was a new 1983 DateJust.

I purchased my first Rolex in 1994, a new Explorer II Polar. Then (all new from authorized dealers) a 2010 DateJust, 2018 Submariner Date 40mm, 2019 Explorer II 42mm, 2023 Submariner Date, and so on.

My Uncles all have multiple Rolex watches.

A few of my brothers have multiple Rolex watches.

While I cannot prove 100% that every year since 1967 Rolex has raised prices, I believe if not all of them in many years they did and still do.

What is your hypothesis based on?

Personal experience, which is of course no more or less relevant than yours, combined with excellent powers of recall of various ADs in London telling me that a price increase was coming, because there hadn’t been one for a couple of years etc.

Mind you I also had at the back of my mind that I had seen a few charts on the internet, which based upon the source, I put more store by than the oft quoted “Rolex increase their prices every year”.

Oh I have found a couple that I remembered are out there…

https://www.minus4plus6.com/PriceEvolution.php

https://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.php? ... ight=Rolex

Based upon the sources that I have linked to I will accept them as indicative that it is indeed the case that Rolex do not (always) increase prices every year. One in US$ for the USA territory and one in UK£ for the UK.

I certainly remember the four year period, as that’s the one when ADs kept telling me about a forthcoming increase that took rather a long time to turn up.

The eight year period was before my time of being interested in and buying the occasional Rolex.

Neil

Would this debate, which apparently we are not entering , not be better in a separate thread? Its relevance to the CW sale is marginal at best.

iain wrote: ↑Sat Jan 11, 2025 10:08 am ^^^^ I don’t know Steve, it could be helpful to the person who is weighing up whether to buy a watch in the CW sale, or use the money to go towards buying a Rolex now in order to beat the inevitable/possible price rise which is coming this year/next year/in 4 to 8 years time…..

Exactly Iain. I aim to please.

Neil

iain wrote: ↑Sat Jan 11, 2025 10:08 am ^^^^ I don’t know Steve, it could be helpful to the person who is weighing up whether to buy a watch in the CW sale, or use the money to go towards buying a Rolex now in order to beat the inevitable/possible price rise which is coming this year/next year/in 4 to 8 years time…..

You guys break me up! I was beginning to wonder what had happened to good ol’ banter.

nbg wrote: ↑Sat Jan 11, 2025 9:50 am Personal experience, which is of course no more or less relevant than yours, combined with excellent powers of recall of various ADs in London telling me that a price increase was coming, because there hadn’t been one for a couple of years etc.

Mind you I also had at the back of my mind that I had seen a few charts on the internet, which based upon the source, I put more store by than the oft quoted “Rolex increase their prices every year”.

Oh I have found a couple that I remembered are out there…

https://www.minus4plus6.com/PriceEvolution.php

https://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.php? ... ight=Rolex

Based upon the sources that I have linked to I will accept them as indicative that it is indeed the case that Rolex do not (always) increase prices every year. One in US$ for the USA territory and one in UK£ for the UK.

I certainly remember the four year period, as that’s the one when ADs kept telling me about a forthcoming increase that took rather a long time to turn up.

The eight year period was before my time of being interested in and buying the occasional Rolex.

Neil

Did you review the data in the first chart you posted? It actually helps prove my point from earlier...

nycWATCHnerd wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 9:47 pm They may not raise prices on every watch every year but they do raises prices on some/different watches every year.

I have no desire to debate or continue this conversation any further so I will end with what my 79 year old mother tells my 82 year old father when she knows he is wrong but does not have the energy or desire to continue the conversation with him: you might be right.

tikkathree wrote: ↑Sat Jan 11, 2025 11:08 am

Amor Vincit Omnia wrote: ↑Sat Jan 11, 2025 10:24 am

iain wrote: ↑Sat Jan 11, 2025 10:08 am ^^^^ I don’t know Steve, it could be helpful to the person who is weighing up whether to buy a watch in the CW sale, or use the money to go towards buying a Rolex now in order to beat the inevitable/possible price rise which is coming this year/next year/in 4 to 8 years time…..

You guys break me up! I was beginning to wonder what had happened to good ol’ banter.

I just followed down this page of this thread and my suggestion is that the winter sales - or the accompanying winter weather - has induced a level of frostiness not often seen here. I hope I'm wrong though.

For me, this is all in good fun but I am tapping out before it goes sideways.

nycWATCHnerd wrote: ↑Sat Jan 11, 2025 1:12 pm

nbg wrote: ↑Sat Jan 11, 2025 9:50 am Personal experience, which is of course no more or less relevant than yours, combined with excellent powers of recall of various ADs in London telling me that a price increase was coming, because there hadn’t been one for a couple of years etc.

Mind you I also had at the back of my mind that I had seen a few charts on the internet, which based upon the source, I put more store by than the oft quoted “Rolex increase their prices every year”.

Oh I have found a couple that I remembered are out there…

https://www.minus4plus6.com/PriceEvolution.php

https://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.php? ... ight=Rolex

Based upon the sources that I have linked to I will accept them as indicative that it is indeed the case that Rolex do not (always) increase prices every year. One in US$ for the USA territory and one in UK£ for the UK.

I certainly remember the four year period, as that’s the one when ADs kept telling me about a forthcoming increase that took rather a long time to turn up.

The eight year period was before my time of being interested in and buying the occasional Rolex.

Neil

Did you review the data in the first chart you posted? It actually helps prove my point from earlier...

nycWATCHnerd wrote: ↑Fri Jan 10, 2025 9:47 pm They may not raise prices on every watch every year but they do raises prices on some/different watches every year.

I have no desire to debate or continue this conversation any further so I will end with what my 79 year old mother tells my 82 year old father when she knows he is wrong but does not have the energy or desire to continue the conversation with him: you might be right.

The dates of increases are shown in the chart. The gaps between those dates are more than a year in many instances…



Neil