Amor Vincit Omnia wrote: ↑Thu Apr 13, 2023 8:38 pm

Legore wrote: ↑Thu Apr 13, 2023 1:21 pm What finally made me decide CW over Sinn was when I saw people say that the Sinn 104 bracelet is trash and the finishing quality is so bad the hands look super rough and this one guy said he had skin flakes on his dial and he posted pics too.

Out of interest, have you handled one or seen one close up? I'm not condoning people laying into you on WUS (I don't go there, so can't comment) and I haven't handled a Sinn either, so can't comment on that, but there are people on here who own them and seem pretty pleased with them.

I do think it's very easy to get monomaniacal and blinkered on these "interest" forums, whether it be watches, headphones or anything else.

Yeah thats the downside with watches that don't have much AD presence and with Sinn watchbuys is the only AD in America. However I've seen from multiple people on Reddit and watchuseek saying that the clasp on the bracelet is trash and practically made out of tinfoil. This other guy posted very detailed pictures showing how rough the finishing is on the hands and how he had skin flakes under his crystal. Maybe they were just outlying examples, but IMO I don't think that's acceptable for the price and I was STILL considering getting one despite all that, but considering they literally JUST raised their price again 10% over night, I am very much turned off. Because now that watch is over 2 thousand after taxes and there's no way it's worth it, to me at least.

People talk a lot about heritage as the main reason to buy one, but Helmut Sinn wanted his watches to be accessible which is why he went for the direct to customer model, but the company has definitely lost those principles over the years. So this may be a spicy take, but now it seems like CW is what Sinn was.

Well, far be it from me to argue with the denizens of Reddit and WUS. Maybe some of the happy Sinners on here will chip in where I can’t.

Legore wrote: ↑Thu Apr 13, 2023 1:21 pm I think deep down they know that CW offers unbeatable value and objectively you're getting the same finishing quality of watches that costs thousands more and they don't want to see their precious heritage brands look bad so they try to cheapen CW by saying it's like San Martin.

You could well be right.

Also, the WUS thread shows a tiny but vocal minority prioritising a brand name (and their perception of its prestige) above all. It speaks volumes about them.

@Legore As long as CW can uphold that ethos for the future, it'd be great but if prices are to increase it will be unavoidable as I don't think CW would be willing to forsake any quality drops.

They have also been transparent that their pricing has generally been 3x the cost.

You could also argue they have been underselling their bel canto (R&D, services from Armin Strom and Chronade)

Legore wrote: ↑Thu Apr 13, 2023 1:21 pm I said that I think the C60 300 is a better buy than the Sinn 104 (especially with how much Sinn costs now in 2023) people lost their ****. This one guy on watchuseek threw a hissyfit and called me a troll because I was "insulting a forum favorite comparing it to a controversial brand with no heritage" - he literally said that Lol.

I’m baffled why CW attracts such polarising responses compared to many other brands

I see praise for various Swiss brands (Tissot, Mido, Longines) and German greats (Sinn, Damasko). None attract numerous negative comments from people who don’t find these brands to their tastes, yet CW does. Why?

And on a positive note, CW has this forum dedicated to it. The others don’t AFAIK. CW must be polarising — why?

@Dilbert
I'd imagine something something logo for a big one.

Early on people didn't trust that idea that you could get a high quality swiss made piece at that price (as CW direct to customer and marketing strategy was purely Internet based) and very much too good to be true (think like eBay if a deal is too good to be true, it probably is. 60/60 policy)

You buy the seller (they had no heritage, literally started by 3 guys in a pub) and also it started as an English brand where we more or less had little watchmaking means vs. The Swiss, Japanese or German (I.e. Sinn and Damasko)
So you can imagine you would have some level of stigma built up and having preconceived notions.

BUT, if you do somewhat like the design, I 'Do your research' and find out in interviews or blogs that report promising things about CW like their ethos, where the cases were made (same as Tudor...I really need to document sources...), Synergie Horologie and how they tied in.

IF you didn't like the designs to begin with, in all likelihood they would go through the trouble and go on with the preconceived notions and I'm also guilty of this like snubbing TAG or Panerai for some movement practices or something (naturally the backlash worked - also still guilty as I haven't delved into the full history of it).

dilbert wrote: I’m baffled why CW attracts such polarising responses compared to many other brands

I see praise for various Swiss brands (Tissot, Mido, Longines) and German greats (Sinn, Damasko). None attract numerous negative comments from people who don’t find these brands to their tastes, yet CW does. Why?

And on a positive note, CW has this forum dedicated to it. The others don’t AFAIK. CW must be polarising — why?

My feeling is that a great deal of the "watch game" is about status and snobbery. Ultimately most CW watches are just too reasonably priced to be accepted by many watch snobs who don't want to talk to their friends about the quality and value for money but about price and scarcity.

I think this is why the Bel canto was such game-changing product because it is not only beautiful and complicated but also costs quite a lot of money and is therefore accepted by both CW enthusiasts and watch snobs alike. In my view it has shifted CW's position in the watch world for good.

Apologies if the post above is confusing, I didn't manage to quote the post by @dilbert properly. oops

@markee Easily fixed.

does not sound much like me anyway. Not much hair and drive a loud hot hatch that only drinks 4 star ! Have never even heard of Birkenstocks !

@markee
I agree that snobbery and status are part of the watch game, but also think that people who display these aspects of the game most are maybe most likely to be shouting their opinions on social media. Social media is like a megaphone for people who think their opinions are more important than everyone else. I believe we all have our snobberies, but this forum is a pretty civilised place.

@missF

One can learn to ignore them. I just tell Ingrid to keep the goats penned up and not let them over the bridge today.

My C60 300 came in today. After seeing it in person I don't give a damn what any CW hater says. This watch is Amazing! I chose this watch over the Oris Aquis Date and the Sinn 104. I have seen all 3 in person now and I definitely think this is the winner.

Man bun, Bicycle, EV and Birkenstock. I tick 3 out of 4 boxes here, but haven’t received my CW yet

supermariner wrote: ↑Sat Apr 22, 2023 10:10 am Man bun, Bicycle, EV and Birkenstock. I tick 3 out of 4 boxes here, but haven’t received my CW yet

You could be a poster boy for CW... is that your eye on the advertising for the new ‘12’?