Swimming and watches

Discuss Christopher Ward watches
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Jape
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Re: Swimming and watches

Post by Jape »

Dancematt wrote:Why be scared or sad if it stops? not sure i understand that myself. I always feel happy that im giving it a rest and service intervals have been prolonged a tad but thats probably just me.
Because I've understood it doesn't do good for the mechanism to wind it too often after it's stopped.
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Re: Swimming and watches

Post by downer »

Jape wrote:
Dancematt wrote:Why be scared or sad if it stops? not sure i understand that myself. I always feel happy that im giving it a rest and service intervals have been prolonged a tad but thats probably just me.
Because I've understood it doesn't do good for the mechanism to wind it too often after it's stopped.
Some people say that using too much use of the winding crown is bad for some automatic watches. Personally, I think it is a bit of an old-wives tale. For sure, the more you use something, the quicker it will wear, but seriously, winding crowns are engineered for winding, so they will not wear out quickly.

In any event, most automatics require only a couple of winds and a gentle shake to get them going. Once the rotor starts doing its job, there is nothing worry about.

I'm convinced that allowing a watch to stop is no more harmful than running it 24x7. In fact, I think it does prolong the service interval, thereby reducing cost of ownership. 8)
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Re: Swimming and watches

Post by Uncle Bill »

There are two common worries in these posts; getting wet and also starting/setting autos...
In 'General Watchmaking' is the Oris pressure chart we added years and years ago (well, three) and the point there was the local pressure momentarily inflicted on seals by movement underwater or an enthusiastic shower...
- then autos. Give it a few winds and set the time/hands to below ten to two. Change the date to yesterday's date, then advance the time through midnight to see if you are at the beginning or middle of the day. The date changes as the hands cross the top(ish) of the dial. If it doesn't change the first time you know that it is on the mid-day twelve; keep going until it changes, then advance the time to the am or pm that you want. You'll have the correct date and morning or afternoon as it should be. Simples... UB :)
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Re: Swimming and watches

Post by Amor Vincit Omnia »

Thank you, chaps.
Some reassurance from the experts that you're doing it properly is always appreciated! 8)
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Re: Swimming and watches

Post by Jape »

Amor Vincit Omnia wrote:Thank you, chaps.
Some reassurance from the experts that you're doing it properly is always appreciated! 8)
Indeed. Thank you for the advice.
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Re: Swimming and watches

Post by Russ-Shettle »

downer wrote:
Jape wrote:
Dancematt wrote:Why be scared or sad if it stops? not sure i understand that myself. I always feel happy that im giving it a rest and service intervals have been prolonged a tad but thats probably just me.
Because I've understood it doesn't do good for the mechanism to wind it too often after it's stopped.
Some people say that using too much use of the winding crown is bad for some automatic watches. Personally, I think it is a bit of an old-wives tale. For sure, the more you use something, the quicker it will wear, but seriously, winding crowns are engineered for winding, so they will not wear out quickly.

In any event, most automatics require only a couple of winds and a gentle shake to get them going. Once the rotor starts doing its job, there is nothing worry about.

I'm convinced that allowing a watch to stop is no more harmful than running it 24x7. In fact, I think it does prolong the service interval, thereby reducing cost of ownership. 8)
I’ve got 3 automatics and I will wear each one at a time for about a month or two before changing up to the next. During that 2 to 4 month period any one of them will remain completely unwound. The only people who will try and convince you that it’s harmful are those trying to sell you a winder, in my opinion. They will tell you that the oils will go bad. That was true years ago but I doubt it’s still the case today, especially with all the modern synthetic oils available and used in watches today.

As for your other issue concerning the wear and tear by excessive winding. I’m thinking you might have that confused with what you may have heard about the wear posed on “screw down” crowns for water tightness. I have heard the claim that you should limit the number of times you screw the crown in and out when having to set the time and date. To me, it’s just another scare tactic for selling you a watch winder.

However, wear is possible. By design, the crown screws down onto a threaded post. The water seal is inside the crown so that when it’s screwed down, the post tightens against the seal which is up inside the crown. This is most effective and the best way to ensure water tightness. The issue is the wear posed on the seal when the crown is repeatedly loosened and tightened. They also claim that this will induce thread wear as well. I believe the seal will eventually wear if this is done excessively and especially if the crown is over tightened each time.

My advice would be to leave the crown just barely snug, not tight. There’s no need to screw the crown down tight unless you plan on getting wet somehow or you go swimming with your watch on. You can eliminate pre-mature wear by just making good sense of it while not worrying about it getting wet. Thread wear takes place when there’s undo stress on the threads from pressure but in this application; the only stress likely to take place would from over tightening the crown onto the post. Just lightly snug it.
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Re: Swimming and watches

Post by Jape »

Right. I think based on this info I won't shy away from buying an automatic. And nice to know winders are not a must. I kind of thought they sound a bit of an overkill...

Thanks for a thorough answer, Russ. :)
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Re: Swimming and watches

Post by Russ-Shettle »

Jape wrote:Right. I think based on this info I won't shy away from buying an automatic. And nice to know winders are not a must. I kind of thought they sound a bit of an overkill...

Thanks for a thorough answer, Russ. :)
Just to re-cap....

A person, who buys to own an automatic versus a quartz of the same model, does so for reasons that are usually very profound and personal. If you’re not particularly interested in mechanical movements then why put yourself in the position to not be sure or as you put it, “shy away from” unless, the particular watch you’re interested in only comes as an auto.

You might not buy one because you’ve been led to think that if you don’t keep it running it’s going to self destruct in 30 days! And the other one is: Not using a winder, you will have to unscrew the crown constantly in order to reset the date and time and if you do that too much you’ll destroy the threads and ruin the water seal. If it’s truly that bad, then I wouldn’t buy any watch that had a screw down crown but like I said before, you can work the crown with care to prevent any potential wear.

But don’t get me wrong about winders. I’m not saying there’s anything wrong with having or putting a winder to good use. I think they would be most useful for short term use, for example; if you have two autos and you’re switching every other day or two or three to wear both. Then yes, this would prevent you from having to reset the time and date constantly. I don’t however, see the necessity of leaving a watch on a winder for long periods of time, especially for the reason that it’s not good for a watch not stay running. “Hog Wash” And if you did, eventually anyway, you’ll have to reset the time regardless because mechanical watches will drift to some degree over time.

All of my autos run a few seconds fast per day and I have to turn the time back a couple of minutes once every 3 to 4 weeks, more or less. But when you own a mechanical watch for the special reasons that make them great, it becomes a “LABOR OF LOVE” and a true lover of mechanical watches will not mind or care one bit about this tiny, infinitesimal disparity.

As for “screw down crowns”, both mechanical and quartz watches will have this so it’s not just for the protection of the auto. So this one factor should not be a decision making consequence of quartz versus auto.
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Re: Swimming and watches

Post by Jape »

Thanks again.

I do appreciate automatics because of their mechanical movements, and would prefer buying them. However, with my slightly neurotic mind I would probably be nervous about them stopping all the time if I wore them a day at a time, let's say. A good solution would be to do like you: wear one for a longer period, and let the others stop. As you said, that wouldn't be bad for the mechanism since the winding is done relatively rarely.

So, maybe automatics to be worn day in, day out, with a quartz (C6 Kingfisher) as a sort of beater for swimming and other pursuits in which I don't want to wear a nice automatic (that I might have risked by winding the screw-down crown too often too carelessly).

Or... just buy automatics and winders... :D

Anyway, I do appreciate your very informative posts and will in all likelihood return to them when I contemplate on the next purchase.
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Re: Swimming and watches

Post by Russ-Shettle »

Jape wrote:Thanks again.

I do appreciate automatics because of their mechanical movements, and would prefer buying them. However, with my slightly neurotic mind I would probably be nervous about them stopping all the time if I wore them a day at a time, let's say. A good solution would be to do like you: wear one for a longer period, and let the others stop. As you said, that wouldn't be bad for the mechanism since the winding is done relatively rarely.

So, maybe automatics to be worn day in, day out, with a quartz (C6 Kingfisher) as a sort of beater for swimming and other pursuits in which I don't want to wear a nice automatic (that I might have risked by winding the screw-down crown too often too carelessly).

Or... just buy automatics and winders... :D

Anyway, I do appreciate your very informative posts and will in all likelihood return to them when I contemplate on the next purchase.
Jape, here's something to think about....

I’ll bet you, if you’re an average active person, you could alternate between two automatic watches daily and neither one would ever stop running. I’ve done this and I’ve also experimented by putting on a fully wound-down auto and not give it any manual wind-up to see how long it takes to get going on its own. Of course, results depend on what you’re doing at the time and so, to give it its best chance, I decided to begin the experiment first thing in the morning when I’m waking up, getting dressed, fixing breakfast. Lot’s of activity there! The loss of time was un-measurable because it was somewhere under one minute. In other words; it pretty much started up right away. The second part of that experiment was to see how much reserve time it had after taking it off when I went to bed. That’s when I realized that autos will wind themselves up most of the way unless you’re somewhat of a half-dead person, bed ridden or something like that. The power reserve was over 22 hours and I had worn it for maybe 18 hours that day before going to bed. It was still running the next day when I came home from work. I was actually amazed and since then I never worried about my autos stopping. As long as it’s on your wrist it will run forever. My watch stays on my wrist all the time. I’ve always worn my watches to bed as well. The only time I take it off is when I’m in the shower.

Russ
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