MichaelMD wrote: ↑Sat Oct 28, 2023 2:54 pm

FloridaPhil wrote:So, does this watch need to live on a winder? I should think that resetting it would be rather a pain in the derriere...

From my experience, you just look up the date of the last full moon, set the moon to full, and advance the moon forward for each day since. Pretty painless especially since there's no date to fool with on this one.

From looking at reviews you can't do that, as the crown mechanism turns the visible watch backwards, anti clockwise, which is the opposite way to the watch advancing. You also don't get a daily click, as it's a perpetual movement.

Maybe you have to set the new moon, then actually wind the time on for several days to reach the current moon appearance.

ajax87 wrote: ↑Fri Oct 27, 2023 12:57 am In addition to what @Bahnstormer_vRS said above regarding the possibility (or impossibility) of a more subtle moonphase, I just ran across an article on Esquire in which Mike France himself is quoted as follows:

“The most asked-for complication was the moonphase. What we wanted to do was celebrate that magnificent celestial being in all of its glory. And so none of this ‘small aperture at 6 o’clock' nonsense for us. We wanted a huge moonphase."

https://www.esquire.com/uk/watches/a456 ... ase-watch/

I bolded the important bit

I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you!

I'm with him on this one, there are watches out there with varying degrees of small moon displays, but both CW offerings bring the moon to the fore, the watches' primary reason for being. I like both the phase and glow versions. If buying one, I'd like to see them together in person.

Looking at CW's last two success, the Bel Canto and the Twelve, both capitalise on being very distinctive and far from middle of the road creations. Works for me!

virgilmerk wrote: ↑Sat Oct 28, 2023 7:50 am

ajax87 wrote: ↑Fri Oct 27, 2023 12:57 am In addition to what @Bahnstormer_vRS said above regarding the possibility (or impossibility) of a more subtle moonphase, I just ran across an article on Esquire in which Mike France himself is quoted as follows:

“The most asked-for complication was the moonphase. What we wanted to do was celebrate that magnificent celestial being in all of its glory. And so none of this ‘small aperture at 6 o’clock' nonsense for us. We wanted a huge moonphase."

https://www.esquire.com/uk/watches/a456 ... ase-watch/

I bolded the important bit

I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you!

Do you think it is possible to have a subtle moonphase complication in the future?

Only Mike France can say, but I’d guess the chances are very very low.

Thinking out loud here and lacking any real technical knowledge, it seems to me that the JJ04 is predicated upon the moon wheel being mounted on the central arbour. Placing it elsewhere, for example in a sub dial, would probably entail a lot of mechanical restructuring. If that’s the case (please correct if I’m wrong) then I don’t see a different layout on the horizon. I think it’s also fair to say that, with all the Christopher Ward moon phase watches, the complication has been the raison d’être of the watch.

JAFO wrote:

MichaelMD wrote: ↑Sat Oct 28, 2023 2:54 pm

FloridaPhil wrote:So, does this watch need to live on a winder? I should think that resetting it would be rather a pain in the derriere...

From my experience, you just look up the date of the last full moon, set the moon to full, and advance the moon forward for each day since. Pretty painless especially since there's no date to fool with on this one.

From looking at reviews you can't do that, as the crown mechanism turns the visible watch backwards, anti clockwise, which is the opposite way to the watch advancing. You also don't get a daily click, as it's a perpetual movement.

Maybe you have to set the new moon, then actually wind the time on for several days to reach the current moon appearance.

I've seen videos of the moonphase being set and it does jump in increments (which I have to assume are 24 hr increments) when you are setting the moon phase via the crown. When it is running normally it does a constant sweep with the hour hand.

MichaelMD wrote: ↑Sat Oct 28, 2023 6:16 pm

JAFO wrote:

MichaelMD wrote: ↑Sat Oct 28, 2023 2:54 pm From my experience, you just look up the date of the last full moon, set the moon to full, and advance the moon forward for each day since. Pretty painless especially since there's no date to fool with on this one.

From looking at reviews you can't do that, as the crown mechanism turns the visible watch backwards, anti clockwise, which is the opposite way to the watch advancing. You also don't get a daily click, as it's a perpetual movement.

Maybe you have to set the new moon, then actually wind the time on for several days to reach the current moon appearance.

I've seen videos of the moonphase being set and it does jump in increments (which I have to assume are 24 hr increments) when you are setting the moon phase via the crown. When it is running normally it does a constant sweep with the hour hand.

What videos? I’d be surprised if they’ve reworked the JJ04 movement. On my moonglow, setting the Moonphase rotates the moon disk smoothly, not in increments. You can set the Moonphase independently of the time, but when you set the time, whether forward or back, the moon phase moves with it.

I agree with CW's reasoning that if they are going to do a moonphase, they might as well do it differently, with their JJ04 module and the large moon disc (which as @Amor Vincit Omnia states, is likely to be rotating from the centre).

I have a very pretty Montblanc day/month/date-pointer moonphase, and I love the wonderful blued leaf hands, but ultimately it's running on a Sellita with standard modules, and in a very common layout found in so many other watches.

CW will definitely want to stand out from the crowd with their moonphase.

asqwerth wrote: ↑Sun Oct 29, 2023 4:01 am I agree with CW's reasoning that if they are going to do a moonphase, they might as well do it differently, with their JJ04 module and the large moon disc

CW will definitely want to stand out from the crowd with their moonphase.

In some respects it does and in some respects it doesn't. There are many brands that have used equally large moon disks, including Arnold & Son (more than once), Meistersinger, Moser, Hermes and Perrelet. Some of these rotate around the dial, others have two moons and so on. Christian Van Der Klauw specialises in dials of moonphases and astonomy generally. Many brands produce 'starry, starry night' dials. That's not to say CW's version isn't worthy in it's own right. But it's really just another variation on a theme.

Caller wrote: ↑Sun Oct 29, 2023 2:23 pm

asqwerth wrote: ↑Sun Oct 29, 2023 4:01 am I agree with CW's reasoning that if they are going to do a moonphase, they might as well do it differently, with their JJ04 module and the large moon disc

CW will definitely want to stand out from the crowd with their moonphase.

In some respects it does and in some respects it doesn't. There are many brands that have used equally large moon disks, including Arnold & Son (more than once), Meistersinger, Moser, Hermes and Perrelet. Some of these rotate around the dial, others have two moons and so on. Christian Van Der Klauw specialises in dials of moonphases and astonomy generally. Many brands produce 'starry, starry night' dials. That's not to say CW's version isn't worthy in it's own right. But it's really just another variation on a theme.

Sure, but I think the moonphase with day/date/month layout/style/theme (with or without chronograph) is still by far the most common.

Those watch brands you listed - pretty august company for CW!

At least it can be said that the CW has been using their big moon disk+JJ04 for quite a few years now, so it's a style they have developed for some time with their successive models.

Meistersinger's atelier is SH, and I'm sure they are using the JJ04. Just like they've used, for instance, the CW/SH jump hour, single-pusher , etc complications in the past. I believe CW had first dibs on those complications, after which Meistersinger would be allowed to use it [and their models are more expensive than CW's]

asqwerth wrote: ↑Sun Oct 29, 2023 2:57 pm
Those watch brands you listed - pretty august company for CW!

And I’m pretty sure “at this price point” would feature somewhere in the argument.

asqwerth wrote: ↑Sun Oct 29, 2023 2:57 pmThose watch brands you listed - pretty august company for CW!

At least it can be said that the CW has been using their big moon disk+JJ04 for quite a few years now,

Meistersinger's atelier is SH, and I'm sure they are using the JJ04. J

Absolutely.

The point I was making is that using such large moons isn't such a novel ID. Initially, CW's was almost a homage of Arnold & Sons. I did wonder if Meistersingers Lunascope, introduced in 2018, was using a JJ module, but seemingly not.

Caller wrote: ↑Mon Oct 30, 2023 3:29 pm

... I did wonder if Meistersingers Lunascope, introduced in 2018, was using a JJ module, but seemingly not.

I suspect it is, in the same way the bremont movement is an improved/tweaked horage movement. There's some borrowed /shared IP going on, methinks.

Caller wrote: ↑Mon Oct 30, 2023 3:29 pm

asqwerth wrote: ↑Sun Oct 29, 2023 2:57 pmThose watch brands you listed - pretty august company for CW!

At least it can be said that the CW has been using their big moon disk+JJ04 for quite a few years now,

Meistersinger's atelier is SH, and I'm sure they are using the JJ04. J

Absolutely.

The point I was making is that using such large moons isn't such a novel ID. Initially, CW's was almost a homage of Arnold & Sons. I did wonder if Meistersingers Lunascope, introduced in 2018, was using a JJ module, but seemingly not.

I would be very surprised if it wasn't using the JJ04 module, do you think Synergies Horlogères would have gone to the trouble of developing a brand new module for MeisterSinger when they had already had one in production that worked with the same movement and had exactly the same functionality and accuracy?

The base caliber visible through the exhibition case back is the automatic ETA 2836-2 coupled with a moonphase module (one that was developed with Synergies Horlogères) that’s accurate to one day every 128 years.

Baselworld 2018: Introducing the MeisterSinger Lunascope.

It is definitely the JJ04 module.

From the linked article above...

"The base caliber visible through the exhibition case back is the automatic ETA 2836-2 coupled with a moonphase module (one that was developed with Synergies Horlogères) that’s accurate to one day every 128 years."