Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Discuss Christopher Ward watches
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by strapline »

Amor Vincit Omnia wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 7:22 pm
strapline wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 6:55 pm I find the 'wider' discussions and observations about watches and watch collecting really interesting. This forum is generally very good for that. :D
I’m really pleased that you find that, Des. We do seem to have a few threads at the moment which have stimulated some really thoughtful and well constructed posts. A pleasure to read and to join in with. :thumbup:
Meant every word, Steve. I always enjoy pottering about on the forum; I agree, there have been a number of good threads of late.

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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by albionphoto »

Viognier wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 4:52 pm
albionphoto wrote: Tue Nov 10, 2020 12:45 pm Great Post Lance. Points 7, 8, 0 and 10 are particularly relevant to me.
Thanks Mark! Any bumps along the way (that you don't mind sharing) that have driven insights that you take to heart?
Didn't I sell you one of them? Bought on impulse in a sale.... Oris Chronoris 2019 Movember (will sell)...
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by Viognier »

albionphoto wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 12:12 am
Didn't I sell you one of them? Bought on impulse in a sale.... Oris Chronoris 2019 Movember (will sell)...
LOL Mark....My Dad wears your alumni C5 Slimline as his daily watch!!! It’s gone to a very good home

Might you share commentary on the Oris and what went sideways ?
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by strapline »

This post is still running and, having woken up this Sunday morning, I wanted to return to something Lance said in the OP, I'll quote it here: 'Advice: Have the HARD chat with yourself; are you buying the brand name? is it the in-house movement you're willing to pay a lot more for? Does the extra money really get you that much more watch for the extra cash outlay?'

For a long time now I've been casting an eye over a Tudor BB41 with the black lacquered dial, the one that looks like an Explorer. I think this is a beautiful watch, one that could be worthy of that title 'one watch collection'. It's sporty, dressy, smart, casual and, I think, timeless in its design. To reference another thread doing the rounds on this forum, it has very strong Tudor and general watch DNA. Personally, I actually prefer it to its more expensive sibling.

But here's the problem; is it really worth €2,800? It's stainless steel, It's powered by an ETA 2824, which are ubiquitous in the modern watch world. As a result of that movement it only has a 38hr power reserve and, it's not a chronometer. But, compared to an Explorer, it's seems something of a bargain. Another €700 spent would get you a Tudor with an in-house movement, 70hrs of power reserve and COSC certification.

I've tried the watch on and it's very captivating with a lot of presence but, from a 'workings' point of view it's unremarkable. I guess it's more akin to a costly piece of jewellery. So, returning to Lance's original point, 'does the extra money really get you that much more watch for the extra cash outlay?' I could probably get a similar specced watch from a lesser brand for a fraction of the cost.

I would, of course, be delighted to hear the view of anyone that owns one of these watches, I'm certain there are a couple on the forum.

Des
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by Amor Vincit Omnia »

strapline wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 11:33 am
But here's the problem; is it really worth €2,800? It's stainless steel, It's powered by an ETA 2824, which are ubiquitous in the modern watch world. As a result of that movement it only has a 38hr power reserve and, it's not a chronometer.

I would, of course, be delighted to hear the view of anyone that owns one of these watches, I'm certain there are a couple on the forum.
I don’t own one, Des, so my comments here will naturally be of the general variety.

How to put a price on a watch? Objectively, and taking into consideration the features you mention, the inclination is to say no, it’s probably not worth it. I would have no particular difficulty with that answer, simply because the watch in question has no great attraction for me. However...

Making a purely cerebral decision on something like this is quite difficult. The watch clearly has an attraction for you, so you will understandably see it differently. You cannot really avoid factoring in the personal angle.

I’ll give you an example. A few years ago I declared the intention to buy a Cartier Tank, which of course I did. A couple of people did raise the value for money question at the time. However, I was going into it with totally open eyes. I was prepared to admit quite candidly that I wanted the brand and the look. I never had a moment’s hesitation then, and I’ve never had a moment’s regret since.

Treat what other people say with respect, but at the end of the day you have to follow your inclinations, your nose, your instincts or your heart, whatever you wish to call it. Good luck.
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by Gripper »

strapline wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 11:33 am For a long time now I've been casting an eye over a Tudor BB41 with the black lacquered dial, the one that looks like an Explorer. I think this is a beautiful watch, one that could be worthy of that title 'one watch collection'. It's sporty, dressy, smart, casual and, I think, timeless in its design. To reference another thread doing the rounds on this forum, it has very strong Tudor and general watch DNA. Personally, I actually prefer it to its more expensive sibling.

I would, of course, be delighted to hear the view of anyone that owns one of these watches, I'm certain there are a couple on the forum.

Des
I have the Tudor BB41 in blue. I think it's a great watch and so versatile as you say. From what I've read it's top grade ETA 2824 heavily modified and regulated. The bracelet is really comfortable and the watch wears really well on the wrist and is so legible.

I got lucky and picked mine up a couple months ago brand new from an AD for £1,700 :D , would I have paid RRP? After owning it for a couple of months, yes I would.

You can pay a bit extra for in house, but as you say you prefer it to it's more expensive sibling. I was attracted to Tudor and it ticked all the boxes for what I was after and after trying it on loved it and was prepared to accept it for what it is. Would have happily settled for a lesser brand with same spec (non modified?) or paid more for in house but it's the watch I wanted and I get great pleasure from it each time I wear it which, in my opinion, means value for money :thumbup:

IMG_20201115_124111 (1).jpg
Last edited by Amor Vincit Omnia on Sun Nov 15, 2020 2:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Tidied up quote and attachment
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by strapline »

Gripper wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 2:21 pm
strapline wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 11:33 am For a long time now I've been casting an eye over a Tudor BB41 with the black lacquered dial, the one that looks like an Explorer. I think this is a beautiful watch, one that could be worthy of that title 'one watch collection'. It's sporty, dressy, smart, casual and, I think, timeless in its design. To reference another thread doing the rounds on this forum, it has very strong Tudor and general watch DNA. Personally, I actually prefer it to its more expensive sibling.

I would, of course, be delighted to hear the view of anyone that owns one of these watches, I'm certain there are a couple on the forum.

Des
I got lucky and picked mine up a couple months ago brand new from an AD for £1,700 :D , would I have paid RRP? After owning it for a couple of months, yes I would.
IMG_20201115_124111 (1).jpg
Thanks for the reply, Mark. Your above comment is a glowing enough endorsement. I thought the bracelet and clasp was superb, all the better for not having faux rivets like the BB58. I really like the slim case profile, 11mm or so. Funnily enough I tried on the blue version and that blue is incredible, very hard to capture in a photo. Although not COSC certified, I bet its timing falls well within that range. I'm going to continue to covet for now, but that trigger may be pulled somewhere down the line.
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by rkovars »

Viognier wrote: Sat Nov 14, 2020 4:54 pm
rkovars wrote: Tue Nov 10, 2020 7:44 pm
I went in the opposite direction. My most expensive watch was the first one I bought (almost 30 years ago). :lol:
Curious if I may; Did you plan the expensive watch purchase that way or simply bought a brilliant watch and it's still with you today?

What drives new purchases in 2020 for you?
Definitely the latter. My first purchase out of the gate was my GMT-Master 1675. Bought it in March of '91. It was my dream watch at the time. This was also back when you could save for 3-4 months, walk into an AD and walk out with whatever you wanted. At the time I liked Subs and Speedies too but the timing never worked out with funds and the GMT sort of cooled the fires so to speak and I sort of stopped thinking about the other watches. Around 2015 or so the GMT started running extremely fast (I hadn't had it serviced since '93). I didn't get it serviced right away. It sat for a couple of years. During that period my love of watches came back with a vengeance. It is a great time to be a watch lover. The quality of watches that you are getting from $500 to $3000 is nothing short of amazing. Of course, I will never part with that first GMT. It was with me through all of my major life events for those years, graduating from college, wars, marriage, everything. So many memories wrapped up in it. I think I like CW because, for me, it falls into that category of when I bought the GMT. The watches aren't cheap but if you save for a while you can grab whichever one catches your eye and you have a solid timepiece. Rolex unfortunately has evolved beyond that point, even in the pre-owned market. It is tough to be mad about it though with so many great choices out there these days.

Since the bug came back it hasn't gone anywhere. Back when I bought that first watch I would like to say I was thoughtful and deliberate but the truth is I just got lucky! I just happened to love the GMT Master. I am an engineer so I have a tendency to go all in and get into the very small details. Watches are great for that.

Sorry so long winded! :yawn: :D
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2 More CW's on the short list! (This is pretty much a lie - I have at least 17 CW Tabs open at the moment!)
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by albionphoto »

Viognier wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 7:58 am
albionphoto wrote: Sun Nov 15, 2020 12:12 am

Didn't I sell you one of them? Bought on impulse in a sale.... Oris Chronoris 2019 Movember (will sell)...
LOL Mark....My Dad wears your alumni C5 Slimline as his daily watch!!! It’s gone to a very good home

Might you share commentary on the Oris and what went sideways ?
I'm glad your Dad enjoys the C5 Slimline. It did indeed go to a good home.
I'm going to blame the WindUp watch fair in NYC and add two more watches to the impulse buys that I should never have made. The Muehle Glashutte ProMare. A great watch but ultimately too big for me. It's not the 44mm case diameter that was its down fall but the really, really long lug tip to lug tip dimension (> 50mm) that finally got me to put it up for sale. Mind you it took four years to make that decision.
Then an Orient with a lume dial. I never wore it and eventually donated it to a charity. Easy come, easy go on that one.
Finally the Oris Chronoris Movember 2019. It's a nice watch but for me it's too small at 39mm. The dial is great at first sight but over time the dull gold colour of the hands and the pips at the indices didn't excite me. The dial (to me) looks too small because of the inner rotating bezel (something the C65 Super COmpressor avoids by making the inner bezel a feature not an after thought. And last but by no means least it doesn't keep time that well either. Many people would be happy with + 11 seconds per day but I'm not. It could be adjusted to be better but I'm not going to do that. I'm used to CWs where all of my recent purchases are within +7 seconds per day and all but one of them are better (even those without COSC certification). In fact some CWs are better than my Omegas.... So this was an affair that was doomed from the start. I've still got it. It's been worn for a total of seven days and it can stay in my watchbox until I decide what to do with it.
The moral of the story might be "Go to watch fairs but leave your wallet at home."
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by Viognier »

Thank you for the detailed replies @rkovars and @albiophoto !

Kind of you both to share your collection stories in detail.
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by Viognier »

I'll add another one....change your straps to quickly and cost effectively change your watch's look!

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=55698
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by Robotaz »

Good advice for the most part, although I have mixed feelings about focusing on preowned.

I would add: 1.) exhaustively research resale values prior to purchase if you have even the slightest doubt that you will keep the watch, 2.) exhaustively research maintenance and parts costs, 3.) do your best to learn not to pull the trigger on impulse buys unless you already have the same value lined up in watches you want to get rid of, 4.) listen carefully to experienced collectors (the shortest comments sometimes carry a ton of weight).
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by Htownsend »

What a great read! I am lucky enough to find myself in a position to buy a better quality watch to what I have had and maybe have several decent watches. The one thing reading this post made me think about is my change in taste. Years ago a big and bulky Tag would of been my go to watch but now🤔. When I bought my 1st CW I did loads of research, but in the end it was simply I kept going back to the same watch that made me buy it. Thanks for the advice for when I do find myself about to make an impulse buy, hopefully making me just stop and think first.
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Re: Forum Dialogue: My watch experience and learnings so far....

Post by Mark_B »

Excellent post!

I agree wholeheartedly with #2 through #10. :thumbup:

#1 I disagree with - I've spent a large amount of money on watches, cars and beer over the years......the rest of my money I've wasted! :lol:

Seriously though..... setting an initial budget and a goal(s) up front is not a bad idea at all, but for me and maybe a lot of people you get more and more drawn in and it evolves and then you are hooked!

I would certainly agree that cheaper watches can bring as much joy (sometimes more) as a more expensive watch. :thumbup:

I'd also agree that doing research (thats where half the fun and learning comes from!), and avoid impulse buys are wise words. - My collection started 20+ years ago predominantly with vintage pieces (mainly due to the cheaper way into mechanical watches), but doing so meant I'd research some of the history and some of the old companies which no longer exist.....and how to service/repair movements (which was often necessary!)......if you don't have LOTS of time don't go that route!!!! :lol:
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