Falling out of love

Chris GB · Post by **Chris GB** » Sun Oct 22, 2023 10:14 pm

I can really sympathise with the disappointment, particularly when we consider the emotional factor of wanting the matching pair as part of a present for a landmark birthday.

The delay on the BMF was notified in June, to those expecting delivery in July. Apparently it's down to some parts not arriving as promised, so a supply chain issue.

I can appreciate both sides of the situation. CW need to sell watches, but they are not turning strip, sheet and bar stock into watches in house, so are completely at the mercy of component suppliers. To some extent, this applies to all manufacturers as no one seems to do raw material to finished item in the watch industry. This is a good thing though, as it tends to drive improvements in product consistency, price and quality.

On the customer's side of the fence, I can also see how disappointing it is to customers when delivery does not conform to the order, be it delivery date or product quality issue. A late delivery is a non conformance and is as much a disappointment as a wonky bezel. I know from experience!

As someone who runs their own businesses, I tend to look at these situations with my business head on. Luxury watches are most definitely an emotive purchase, so delivery delays inevitably reduce the likelihood of ongoing customer engagement. It's not something I'd recommend to my clients. Accountants may well see it differently though. Do we want £100K+ tied up in 300 watches we may not sell? They're almost definitely not going to be keen on that, but miss the bigger picture of lost future revenue.

You do have to wonder how many customers are put off a brand that has a reputation for delivery delays and how may future sales are lost.

For my part, I've ordered four CW watches. Two are subject to delivery delays and one was delivered defective, damaged during rectification and is now not running as well as it should. To a quality assurance manager, that's a 75% defect rate. It is disappointing. I've still got chronograph and dive watch shaped holes in the collection, which were to be filled with CW products, but I'm certainly not sending more money their way until current orders are satisfied. Will I even buy more CW? It was definitely, but it's now possibly. CW watches are excellent value for money, but the competition is catching on and a brand that disappoints is easy to fall out of love with.

Spytap · Post by **Spytap** » Mon Oct 23, 2023 3:25 pm

Chris GB wrote: ↑Sun Oct 22, 2023 10:14 pm I can really sympathise with the disappointment, particularly when we consider the emotional factor of wanting the matching pair as part of a present for a landmark birthday.

The delay on the BMF was notified in June, to those expecting delivery in July. Apparently it's down to some parts not arriving as promised, so a supply chain issue.

I can appreciate both sides of the situation. CW need to sell watches, but they are not turning strip, sheet and bar stock into watches in house, so are completely at the mercy of component suppliers. To some extent, this applies to all manufacturers as no one seems to do raw material to finished item in the watch industry. This is a good thing though, as it tends to drive improvements in product consistency, price and quality.

On the customer's side of the fence, I can also see how disappointing it is to customers when delivery does not conform to the order, be it delivery date or product quality issue. A late delivery is a non conformance and is as much a disappointment as a wonky bezel. I know from experience!

As someone who runs their own businesses, I tend to look at these situations with my business head on. Luxury watches are most definitely an emotive purchase, so delivery delays inevitably reduce the likelihood of ongoing customer engagement. It's not something I'd recommend to my clients. Accountants may well see it differently though. Do we want £100K+ tied up in 300 watches we may not sell? They're almost definitely not going to be keen on that, but miss the bigger picture of lost future revenue.

You do have to wonder how many customers are put off a brand that has a reputation for delivery delays and how may future sales are lost.

For my part, I've ordered four CW watches. Two are subject to delivery delays and one was delivered defective, damaged during rectification and is now not running as well as it should. To a quality assurance manager, that's a 75% defect rate. It is disappointing. I've still got chronograph and dive watch shaped holes in the collection, which were to be filled with CW products, but I'm certainly not sending more money their way until current orders are satisfied. Will I even buy more CW? It was definitely, but it's now possibly. CW watches are excellent value for money, but the competition is catching on and a brand that disappoints is easy to fall out of love with.

Has any solution been provided for the one that was defective then damaged? Is that still in process of being sorted, or were you told “we’ve done all we will/enough”?

Chris GB · Post by **Chris GB** » Mon Oct 23, 2023 4:49 pm

Spytap wrote: ↑Mon Oct 23, 2023 3:25 pm Has any solution been provided for the one that was defective then damaged? Is that still in process of being sorted, or were you told “we’ve done all we will/enough”?

Yes, CW customer service have been good in terms of communication, but because they held no stock of contingency parts, I've got to wait until November when they've offered to assess the movement (I'll update the thread on that shortly) and re-case or replace as applicable. Here's hoping they have set aside the parts for it!

ITCSUK · Post by **ITCSUK** » Thu Nov 02, 2023 5:05 pm

No ordered in March for July delivery stated from CW, got told in June they would be October and then later that it will now be November.
Like many of said, I’m sitting back and waiting.
Will I buy another CW? The answer is no. Again as others have said the competition is catching up fast. There are some really nice watches out there for a good price.

For the time being, I’m happy, but for sure another delay will be frustrating.

Chris GB · Post by **Chris GB** » Sat Nov 18, 2023 11:26 pm

Chris GB wrote: ↑Mon Oct 23, 2023 4:49 pm
Spytap wrote: ↑Mon Oct 23, 2023 3:25 pm Has any solution been provided for the one that was defective then damaged? Is that still in process of being sorted, or were you told “we’ve done all we will/enough”?
Yes, CW customer service have been good in terms of communication, but because they held no stock of contingency parts, I've got to wait until November when they've offered to assess the movement (I'll update the thread on that shortly) and re-case or replace as applicable. Here's hoping they have set aside the parts for it!

Little update, CW didn't set aside inventory for repair, so they've agreed to refund me in full and I've re ordered, so hope to see a new one in December.

Chris GB · Post by **Chris GB** » Mon Nov 27, 2023 5:39 pm

ITCSUK wrote: ↑Thu Nov 02, 2023 5:05 pm No ordered in March for July delivery stated from CW, got told in June they would be October and then later that it will now be November.
Like many of said, I’m sitting back and waiting.
Will I buy another CW? The answer is now. Again as others have said the competition is catching up fast. There are some really nice watches out there for a good price.

For the time being, I’m happy, but for sure another delay will be frustrating.

Have you had any update on this yet? I'm waiting for a Blue Marine myself, getting mighty close to the end of November and I've heard nothing so far.

ITCSUK · Post by **ITCSUK** » Mon Dec 04, 2023 9:44 am

Trs1982 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 22, 2023 5:25 pm Were you given a different ETA when you placed the order?

No not till two months later

ITCSUK · Post by **ITCSUK** » Mon Dec 04, 2023 9:58 am

November has been and gone still no watches. But I’m told ‘could’ be December. Still doesn’t make it any easier From a March 23 order it’s now 9 months CW have had my money.

Just a simple email every month keeping updated and just letting me know would have been a great touch, but I get nothing for weeks when I email. Or when I then have to go through the web request I get the standard “we aim to answer your query in 72hrs”! customer service is terrible

ITCSUK · Post by **ITCSUK** » Mon Dec 04, 2023 3:37 pm

@Chris GB have you had any posative news?
I’ve just heard after chasing….the new expected date Feb 2024!!
Absolutely gutted anything else I would just cancel, but I really want this watch. It’s so frustrating. Horrendous situation

Post by **Bahnstormer_vRS** » Mon Dec 04, 2023 5:38 pm

Commiserations on your situation @ITCSUK and I don't wish to rub salt in your wounds, but it seems that the delays on the Snow Leopard are affecting different customers to varying degrees; although as you're waiting for the Blue Marine version the delays may be due to different issues.

The following has been posted, as a screenshot of an email, on the CWE Facebook Group this afternoon; I have redacted certain parts to preserve privacy.

Customer Services 10:24

to me

Dear ******,

I am reaching out to update you on the delivery status of your C63 SH21 Snow Leopard. I previously said you would receive it end-November but due to delays relating to obtaining COSC certification this now is unfortunately not the case. Your new date for delivery is Mid-Dec.

This is neither the news you wanted to hear, nor that I wished to pass on; we tried all we could to get to have this resolved. This is the reason why I am reaching out so late.

Please accept my sincere apologies for this further delay.

Best wishes,

Mike

Guy

Sent from my Galaxy S23 Ultra using Tapatalk

Chris GB · Post by **Chris GB** » Mon Dec 04, 2023 7:53 pm

ITCSUK wrote: ↑Mon Dec 04, 2023 3:37 pm @Chris GB have you had any posative news?
I’ve just heard after chasing….the new expected date Feb 2024!!
Absolutely gutted anything else I would just cancel, but I really want this watch. It’s so frustrating. Horrendous situation

Yes, I got the email today putting it back to the end of February. While I understand the industry is oversubscribed, I'm not impressed that I've already paid for the item on the basis of the original delivery date. Delivery date is part of the order specification. "Pre order" feels like an annoying scam when deliveries don't materialise. If CW are happy to take a loan from me to make my watch, they should pay it back on time. That, or fund it themselves and ask me to pay when it's ready for delivery.

Adding in the delayed Bel Canto and the mess up with my Twelve, I'm sitting on the fence trying to decide if I like these watches enough to put up with this company taking the p*ss out of me, or should I just cancel all orders and forget the brand exists?

Meanwhile, we see them forging ahead allocating resources to new product launches and leaving existing customers waiting. I guess that if I don't cancel my orders, I'll have to see how the watches make me feel. If I can look at them and think, yes, it was worth the hassle, then I'll be able to accept the delays. On the other hand, I may look at the pieces on my wrist and just be reminded of the frustration and disappointment involved, in which case they're going to be returned. Luxury goods are emotive purchases, CW, take note, it's not a great way for a brand to retain customers.

ITCSUK · Post by **ITCSUK** » Tue Dec 05, 2023 7:39 am

@Bahnstormer_vRS yes, I had the same email, although mine says the end of Feb.

Thanks for the comments though, I do feel like this is some kind of therapy for me, being able to relay my disappointment

I’m not familiar with the COSC, certification. I guess this must be just one little old man in Switzerland watching watches tick away. I would hope to think that if there was a way they could substitute their already waiting watches with these that are overdue by nine months, so that they could jump the queue. I guess they think we’ve already **** off a number of customers why **** off more

As @Chris GB pointed out, we’re bombarded with new products, all the while, and they can’t satisfy the customers that have already paid

rkovars · Post by **rkovars** » Tue Dec 05, 2023 5:36 pm

While I understand the frustration it isn't exactly apples to apples. If the new watches were waiting for the SH21 then they too would be delayed. But they aren't.

According to a 2019 article there are three COSC testing labs across Switzerland. One in Biel/Bienne (which is the one I assume CW uses), one in Saint-Imier and one in Le Locle.

Even in 2019 they were certifying 1.6 million movements per year. This number has only grown. They were running 7 days a week/350 days a year to keep up even then (I wouldn't be surprised of the number of operating days has increased since then). That was before the pandemic. I would not be surprised if they are still behind from pandemic delays. In addition, if anything goes wrong along the process like a part is not ready from the movement supplier and CW misses their window in line for testing there will be a significant delay as COSC can't hold the line for one manufacturer and they need to keep it moving. So CW will get bumped.

I think this also feeds into why CW doesn't offer more COSC options. The logistics are difficult.

With CWs success in the last couple of years there has been some friction between that success and keeping a lean inventory. Going forward I think they are going to have to rethink that balance in order to meet customer demands and to keep the process humming more efficiently.

As an aside, the last year COSC published numbers (2015 - they no longer do citing client confidentiality) they certified 795,716 Rolex movements, 511,861 Omega movements, 147,917 from Breitling. You can see what a hassle it would be trying to fit in your 200 movements. I would guess one of the locations above does nothing but Rolex.

Chris GB · Post by **Chris GB** » Wed Dec 06, 2023 10:13 am

I think that to crystallise why I am finding it difficult to sympathise with CW as a brand, it is because I have given them over £5000 this year. For that money, I have one C63 Sealander to put on my wrist and an inbox full of disappointment.

JAFO · Post by **JAFO** » Wed Dec 06, 2023 2:05 pm

I think if I was buying a new CW watch now, I would probably want to buy instantly the watch appeared on sale, as anything else seems to potential involve delays.

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