C60 Trident Red and Green

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akirk
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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by akirk »

I too have owned 4 tridents (currently on 3) and I am quite happy to see these come out... I like to see a variety of options, and when you consider that all the design work has been done and it is simply a matter of picking a colour then it takes very little effort to produce a green / red model... As CWL seem to be able to make a profit on a FLE at 50 - 100 items, I suspect that they have to sell only a few to make a profit with such little work needed... after that it is simply a matter of profit all the way... the only down side for them is stock they have to hold - and the cash tied up in that...

never had an issue with the C60s and have no particular desire for lume - I have electric lighting at home :)

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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by mintu »

new to watch collection scene.
green is slowly growing on me.
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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by DEV.Woulf »

skimrok wrote:What a load of tosh! I have had 4 tridents in my time no pips have fallen off also no movement failures or crown issues etc, as for changing the date window that's what keeps it a trident there is no mistaken to the wise that's a Chris Ward Trident, however the lume I agree, but the fact is purely in the sales there is more sold then any other model they have so I really think you and a few are in the minority sorry to say,ready for it now?.... Get over it :lol:
I've read about pips falling off for quite a few people on this forum...not to most, no. I hear of issues like that, but then continuously see pictures of the C60/C61 with the bezel alignment issue...having the watch come to the USA with such a stupid issue keeps me from purchasing one. I've already went through two CW returns back to the UK and yeah they paid S&H but it wasn't fun. The bezel issue stings because it's such a dumb problem that should have been remedied before the C61 came out. As for the date, the date is that way because of the desire to reduce cost, not because of design. You may like the square window (as do I) but the off position is because of the inability to customize the movement. It's similar to the Makaira's bezel crown being so close to the crown; it's in an awkward turning position because of the same reason as the Trident's date, to reduce selling price. The date is not a huge deal breaker but I am reminded of the Trident's cheaper price whenever I look at it.

I like the Trident but seeing CW come out with odd colors while not addressing the pip and bezel issues makes me laugh a little. I know they like milking the C60 but this is really funny. :clap:
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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by akirk »

but they have to take a commercial decision... with things like the date...
if they spend more to change it to suit the views of some people then the watch will cost more...
those same people will no doubt then complain about the cost going up... ;)
and they will sell less and make less money - so where is the sense in that commercially?
I have no problem with where the date window is - nor, presumably, do xxxx other people each year who are buying their best seller... I have no desire to spend more on a watch where there would be (in my view) no improvement by moving the date

Chris Ward is, no doubt about it, passionate about watches - but he is also passionate about business - and does what is possible to bring the two together - and it seems to be working... if he just focused on his watch passion (as some seem to want him to) then he would either be making extremely expensive watches or be bust!

At this price point you can not guarantee that you will send out only watches with no issues - to get that level of quality control adds £££ to the price - yes, you can keep pushing to find ways of increasing the % without issues, but CWL (from previous conversations reported on here) monitor the % with issues and are happy that it is very low - I think we forget sometimes how small a % of customers we are on here and therefore how statistically insignificant our observations might be... what a company can do, and they do well is deal with the issues once noted... that is the sign of a customer-focused business...

CWL have always been clear that they are about building the best watch to a price that they can - it is not about building the ultimate watch / the perfect watch...

I agree that pip and bezel issues should be dealt with - but the date is irrelevant to this discussion - and it seems silly to say that they should be focusing on MKII before bringing out other colours - as I posted above - to add in red and green models is probably about 5 minutes work to choose the colours and then a bit of marketing / photography - it is an insignificant amount of time, and I am sure that it is not a choice between adding extra colours and working on new models - I suspect that CWL do both at the same time :)

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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by Berkshire »

Interesting posts. IMO the green and red adds to a winning formula.
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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by scooter »

Just yellow, indigo and violet to go.

We can sing a rainbow too.

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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by Berkshire »

scooter wrote:Just yellow, indigo and violet to go.

We can sing a rainbow too.

scooter
Yellow, interesting. 8)
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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by skimrok »

Deverica Wolf wrote:
skimrok wrote:What a load of tosh! I have had 4 tridents in my time no pips have fallen off also no movement failures or crown issues etc, as for changing the date window that's what keeps it a trident there is no mistaken to the wise that's a Chris Ward Trident, however the lume I agree, but the fact is purely in the sales there is more sold then any other model they have so I really think you and a few are in the minority sorry to say,ready for it now?.... Get over it :lol:
I've read about pips falling off for quite a few people on this forum...not to most, no. I hear of issues like that, but then continuously see pictures of the C60/C61 with the bezel alignment issue...having the watch come to the USA with such a stupid issue keeps me from purchasing one. I've already went through two CW returns back to the UK and yeah they paid S&H but it wasn't fun. The bezel issue stings because it's such a dumb problem that should have been remedied before the C61 came out. As for the date, the date is that way because of the desire to reduce cost, not because of design. You may like the square window (as do I) but the off position is because of the inability to customize the movement. It's similar to the Makaira's bezel crown being so close to the crown; it's in an awkward turning position because of the same reason as the Trident's date, to reduce selling price. The date is not a huge deal breaker but I am reminded of the Trident's cheaper price whenever I look at it.

I like the Trident but seeing CW come out with odd colors while not addressing the pip and bezel issues makes me laugh a little. I know they like milking the C60 but this is really funny. :clap:

I'm like many more which have had no issues absolutely nothing as they say the ones which say nothing far out weighs the issues you have raised as for funnies "the joke is on you jack" ;) yes you guessed it I love them he!he!
Steve

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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by skimrok »

Berkshire wrote:
scooter wrote:Just yellow, indigo and violet to go.

We can sing a rainbow too.

scooter
Yellow, interesting. 8)
and here is me wearing yellow shorts today he!he!
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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by highway62 »

No improvement in altering the date window position & shape?
Should've gone to Specsavers.
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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by robinbarke »

Alasdair, I think you continue to underestimate the % of CW watches bought by members of this forum. I would suggest from frenzied members reported experiences that at least 50% of Last Few Remaining went to Forum members. It is, to me, significant that the 2013 FLE still remains unsold because all forum members who wanted one had one. Perhaps your insider contact will be able to confirm?

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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by akirk »

robinbarke wrote:Alasdair, I think you continue to underestimate the % of CW watches bought by members of this forum. I would suggest from frenzied members reported experiences that at least 50% of Last Few Remaining went to Forum members. It is, to me, significant that the 2013 FLE still remains unsold because all forum members who wanted one had one. Perhaps your insider contact will be able to confirm?

Robin
:D very droll :D unfortunately this is not James Bond and I have no spies in the camp...

I have no idea as to how many active members there are on this forum - but there are 7972 members listed of whom 6,186 have posted under 5 times - so can be considered non-active... of the remaining 1,786 what % on average buy one CWL a year? - if it were 50% (893 watches a year) I would be really surprised... yet at c.20,000 watches sold a year (?) by CWL that would be less than 5% of CWL watches - when you crunch the numbers I suspect that we are a much lower %... maybe 1% - 2% of sales?

to be a significant % we would need the forum to be buying 1,000 - 4,000 watches a year from CWL - is that likely?

I am happy to be surprised and informed that the forum is buying considerably more watches, I just consider it unlikely... and therefore however nice Chris Ward is to us, it is not because we as active members are his main market... we might though be a strong influence, but that doesn't make us his market

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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by asqwerth »

I'm generally pretty objective, and I agree with Mr Wolf ( :D ) that the bezel alignment issue should have been sorted out by now.

After all, I sent both my Red C60 FLE and W61 back for realignment. Very inconvenient.

Pip falling out - I've not had such issues but the fact that quite a few posters here have had this problem is troubling. No idea if it's through a hard knock, rough use, or just bad adhesive. Does Greg (gwells) - who dives with it - still have his bezel pip?

The above 2 are QC issues.

Date window position is not a QC issue. I like the look of my W61 and have never been bothered by where the window is.
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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by robinbarke »

akirk wrote:
robinbarke wrote:Alasdair, I think you continue to underestimate the % of CW watches bought by members of this forum. I would suggest from frenzied members reported experiences that at least 50% of Last Few Remaining went to Forum members. It is, to me, significant that the 2013 FLE still remains unsold because all forum members who wanted one had one. Perhaps your insider contact will be able to confirm?

Robin
:D very droll :D unfortunately this is not James Bond and I have no spies in the camp...

I have no idea as to how many active members there are on this forum - but there are 7972 members listed of whom 6,186 have posted under 5 times - so can be considered non-active... of the remaining 1,786 what % on average buy one CWL a year? - if it were 50% (893 watches a year) I would be really surprised... yet at c.20,000 watches sold a year (?) by CWL that would be less than 5% of CWL watches - when you crunch the numbers I suspect that we are a much lower %... maybe 1% - 2% of sales?

If Forum members are responsible for only 1-2% of sales then I wonder why..

1 CW was keen to acquire the Forum?

2 CW takes pride in promoting The Forum Watch of the Year?

3 Offers Forum members advance notice of sales (and the demand is at such a level to disrupt and delay distribution)?

4 CW considers that the FLE is worthwhile if contribution is insignificant versus all the hassle involved?

And if you buy into the 'upwards of 20,000 watches a year' perhaps with your analytical acumen you can, please, offer some insight into the breakdown of those sales having regard to the availability (still) of original logo watches and the time it takes to move the relatively small numbers of the limited edition pieces.

As ever, Robin
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Re: C60 Trident Red and Green

Post by akirk »

Robin, there are undoubtedly a number of reasons why CWL would buy the forum - the obvious one being that it is a good advocate for the brand, and it needed purchasing as Hans no longer had time to do what was needed... but being a good advocate doesn't mean that it is the main source of income - CWL also promote / re-tweet / etc. blogs and websites with their watch reviews - those websites aren't buying their watches, but they help encourage sales...

Forum Watch of the Year - simple, easy good marketing for CWL, why wouldn't they - looks neutral / independent...

Advance notice of sales - simple, easy way to shift stock, make people feel special by giving them 'advance notice' and they will buy - is it just forum folks - no of course it isn't, anyone can sign up to their newsletter / follow them on facebook / follow them on twitter and get exactly the same - the whole 'preview but not open to the public until xxx' is simply marketing spin - any company does it - it is using understanding of psychology to influence spend...

The FLE - I suspect that the overall cost to CWL is low for the sales of xxx watches - I am pretty sure that I have seen somewhere that they will do limited editions for anyone at 50+ watches (eg the MB watch, lots of the military ones etc.)

As for 20,000 p/a sales - I am simply going on what I have seen on here - maybe it is inaccurate? I don't know, I am a contented customer of CWL, I don't work for them / with them in any way... how on earth you think that anyone outside the company would have the slightest idea as to the breakdown of sales / speed of sales / etc. I have no idea - I can push buttons on a calculator where the numbers are publicly available - I can't tell you their company's detailed financial details - if you really want to know how many they sell, you can no doubt make an educated guess using their company accounts - but it all sounds like too much work!

All of this confirms what I have said above - the forum is a great marketing tool for CWL - it is generally positive, apart from a few cynics ;) and gives a balanced view based on fact and reports as it sees it, so it is not just marketing-speak - in today's online world that is very valuable - all good reasons for CWL to support the forum - but none of which means that the forum is the main source of sales - or even that significant a source, I am very open to my assumptions being corrected by anyone with accurate figures - if in reality the forum buys 2,000 watches a year and CWL only sells 5,000 then that changes the emphasis, but I think that is unlikely...

as for 'insider contacts' 'buying into' 'offering insight' I do think Robin that you need a little less cynicsm and perhaps a little more of a relaxed attitude to the forum / CWL - you seem to take great pleasure in needling others, which is quite un-necessary - we can have a mature discussion without it... ;) I make no claims to having any specific knowledge about CWL - I am however experienced in starting / growing / building businesses as that is what I spend my time doing... it isn't difficult to understand / spot the patterns a business uses... and CW is good at business and his backers have great track-record in business as well...

Alasdair
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